← all The Weekly Substandard episodes
#95. The Substandard on 12 Strong, Eagles, and Rats
Listen to this episode ↗on Substack, where the show lives now
Dudes Chatting — war movies, post-9/11 cinema, and a rat in the bathroom: The episode opens with an extended Eagles-Patriots Super Bowl preview: JVL (in his Brian Dawkins jersey) argues the line should be closer to 3.5 points and thinks Philadelphia has a real shot, while Sonny considers the Patriots the inevitable empire. Before the review segment, Vic recounts discovering a rat (or very large mouse) moving around under a toilet hole during his bathroom renovation, which leads to competing rodent and pest horror stories from Sonny (fly infestation from poison-killed rats in the walls of his old Capitol Hill basement apartment). The main cultural discussion is a ranking of post-9/11 war films. Sonny's list, from #5 to #1: Black Hawk Down, Tears of the Sun, 300, Zero Dark Thirty, and Inglourious Basterds. The trio also debate which war has the best film canon: JVL nominates Starship Troopers (Verhoeven's anti-fascist satire, he argues); Vic makes a case for WWII and recalls seeing Saving Private Ryan with elderly audience members visibly shaken; Sonny champions the Civil War as underrated. They also discuss Taps, Red Dawn, Behind Enemy Lines, and the parallel between the Vietnam film wave of the late 1980s and today's unresolved Iraq/Afghanistan cycle.
Box Office: Jumanji: Welcome to the Jungle led with $20M domestic and was approaching $316M total — on pace for a multiple of 10, a remarkable word-of-mouth run the hosts attribute partly to The Last Jedi underperforming. 12 Strong opened in second place at $16.5M.
Reviews: Sonny reviews 12 Strong, the Chris Hemsworth/Michael Shannon film about the Special Forces horse soldiers who entered Afghanistan with the Northern Alliance in the weeks after 9/11. He calls it a very well-made, action-oriented, thoroughly pro-American war film in the mold of Tears of the Sun — not a morally ambiguous picture but a reminder that "there is evil in the world and it needs to be taken out." Minor complaint: repetitive dialogue re-explains the plan too many times. Verdict: strongly recommended for fans of the genre.
Spirit of the Week is Johnnie Walker 18-Year Blended Scotch, courtesy of Diageo. JVL, fighting off illness, is seen double-fisting it alongside a Shofferhofer grapefruit wheat beer.
Full transcript
Guest00:00:00Philadelphia fans love football in a really dark and disturbing way. The national perception of the Philadelphia sports fan is that they are lunatics, almost pathologically negative. And I think it is a richly justified reputation.
Vic00:00:17If I walk into the link or a couple of years ago, the vet, and I'm wearing a giant shirt or a cowboy jersey, I don't expect bottles to be thrown at my head. I don't expect my life to be threatened. They are violent people, and I think the reason they're hated is because of the reputation they've built as sick, animalistic freaks that have a jail inside their stadium because they cause so much violence.
Guest00:00:41I think they're the best sports fans in America, any sport, any city.
Vic00:00:53Hello, and welcome back to another edition of The Substandard, sponsored by Quip. I'm Victor Matys along with Sonny Bunch and Jonathan V. Last. I'd like to remind you the substandard is available on iTunes, Google Play, and Stitcher. Just look at our podcast and search for substandard. You'll easily find us. Please subscribe, tell your friends, and leave a review. Speaking of reviews, we have gone over the 500 review mark, but we still love to have more reviews come in. Obviously, there are other podcasts that have double or three times the amount. not that we're keeping track of these things but I did have and I know we stopped reading reviews but I was looking at a review and I thought it was really funny and I'd share it with us okay this is a review by a fella a listener named Adam Quincy who says if I only had 24 hours to live I would listen to this podcast because waiting for them to get to the point would feel like forever yeah five stars that's right
Sonny00:01:44that's good that's accurate it's the most accurate review anyone has written about us
JVL00:01:49what she's saying is that this show bends the contours of space time yes
Sonny00:01:53Well, right around Vic's head. That's possible.
JVL00:01:57This is fantastic.
Vic00:01:58Wow. Well, help yourself. I like it. Notes of caramel. It's delicious.
Sonny00:02:04We'll get to drink of the week later, I guess. Or should we do it now? Spirit of the week? Can I go back and forth between this and the shofar?
Vic00:02:10At your own risk. At your own risk. The grapefruit flavor may interview with the caramel notes.
Sonny00:02:14Double fisting. JBL is currently double fisting alcohol. It's the first I've ever seen.
JVL00:02:19I'm sick. What do you want?
Vic00:02:21We'll get to the spirit. We'll have people hanging on here.
Sonny00:02:24What does he love?
Vic00:02:26What is it? What does he finally love? Oh, my goodness. Shannon's going to have to get this for you for Christmas. Okay.
Sonny00:02:32I think they spent their whole gift budget on that jersey. Oh, on that jersey that JVL's wearing.
JVL00:02:38What are we talking about? What are you wearing, JVL? I'm wearing the Nike Elite Edition on-field jersey, the Alt Black.
Sonny00:02:46Wait, wait. Why are you wearing your Nike Elite jersey and not your Nike watch?
JVL00:02:52you just blew my mind that's an excellent yeah i'm looking at that i like to think you're wearing
Sonny00:02:59some crap some crap regular analog watch i like to think elite watch brian dawkins
JVL00:03:05the wolverine weapon x the hall of famer from the eagles number 20 uh i like to think that he wears fine automatic timepieces and not not garbage digital smart watch stuff although i i do enjoy my apple series 3 nike edition for athletes and like brian dawkins i'm an athlete you could actually literally wander onto the field i could i would be allowed in this jersey to wander down onto the field just to go onto the field and to you know play a little football because i i like
Vic00:03:39playing by playing football even like handing out the cups of gatorade to the players no no they don't have same where you squeeze i'll be the guy oh yeah let's get through the helmet because you
Sonny00:03:47squeeze through the helmet if you want. Question. Yeah. What was the Mark Wahlberg movie where he plays the guy who walks onto the field? Invincible. Invincible. So basically, you're invincible right now. Essentially, yes. You're the invincible. Yes.
Vic00:03:58I know we'll get a correction on this. Popoli? Peppoli? Popoli? Popoli? No. Wow.
Sonny00:04:03Do I look Italian? Oh. Ho. But you're from France. Oh. I was going to say,
Vic00:04:08you should know this. This is my room. These are your people. Yeah. No, I think he was the kicker, right? The kicker. And Greg Kinnear playing dick for a meal i think for me there's a very good he's for me yeah he's a very good he looked
Sonny00:04:19like him so did you guys watch i watched parts i watched the i watched what the patriots game because that was good and entertaining and interesting i did not watch the philly
Vic00:04:29drubbing of minnesota minnesota did not show up they didn't show up okay a couple things
JVL00:04:35one entirely understandable because and this is true they didn't show up after an emotional i mean i don't know didn't didn't tennessee lose following the the mass the music city miracle i mean when you when you win a game out of nowhere on a play that will be watched for decades teams that do that all time are 0 72 and 1 in the playoffs what's the one i forget
Sonny00:05:01who tied in the playoffs who tied in the playoffs it's very very right i mean this is it's a letdown
JVL00:05:09You're in a letdown spot. Your Super Bowl was the New Orleans. That was your Super Bowl. That was it. Right. And the Eagles came out, and this Eagles team? They dominated. D-G-A-F. They really are. I mean, they just, you know, they're playing with house money. Everybody has counted them out.
Vic00:05:24S-F-D-G. What is the D-G? Damn good. Don't give. Don't give.
Sonny00:05:28D-G-A-F. Don't give.
Vic00:05:30Oh, I-S-W-Y-D-T. Thank you.
Sonny00:05:34We're not going to. But did you watch?
JVL00:05:36Did you see the flea flicker? No, I literally.
Sonny00:05:38I watched the Patriots game.
JVL00:05:42Did you watch the pick six where he reverses the complete field?
Sonny00:05:46I actually did see that. That was amazing. That was the one play that I saw. Did you see the blocks?
JVL00:05:49I mean, the defense immediately switches and throws blocks to clear lanes for him. It was amazing. You were saying the Pats game.
Sonny00:05:55Can we talk about the actual good game, the Patriots-Jacksonville game? I'm sorry.
JVL00:05:59You're saying that a game involving Jacksonville was the good game? Yes. Just so we're clear. It was much better.
Sonny00:06:04It was much more entertaining. It was close to the end. And finally, the forces of good triumphed in the end. The Patriots defeated the upstart Jaguars. And the NFL's terrorists, really. The football terrorists. And the empire rolled along. And now they're going to get Philadelphia in their Death Star tractor beam. They're going to pull them in. And there's not going to be any Luke Skywalker to save the day. That's all I'm saying.
JVL00:06:31No one denies this. No, the Eagles are going to lose. The line is ridiculous. What is the line? The six and a half. It's five and a half or six and a half.
Vic00:06:37It depends on the status of Brady's hand, yes?
JVL00:06:39No, it just depends on where you're shopping right now. They didn't even wait to see if Gronk could play, and they rushed out five and a half or six and a half. Oh, the concussion, the almost concussion? It should be three, maybe three and a half. The Patriots are a clear favorite. I think the Eagles are good enough to win. I think there is a one in three chance the Eagles could win.
Sonny00:06:55Wait, wait, you think the line should be closer than five and a half or six and a half?
JVL00:06:58Yeah.
Sonny00:07:00Okay.
JVL00:07:01This is, I mean, this is the biggest line that there has been in a decade almost. And for a game which actually should, because of Brady's injury, because of Gronk's status, I think this should be a pretty close line. Look, three and a half is still pretty big. I mean, three and a half is not a pick-em, it's two scores.
Vic00:07:21But right now it's basically pats by a touchdown, is what you're saying.
JVL00:07:24Yeah, which is on a neutral field, that's a lot. They should clearly be the favorite. But on the other hand, I think the Eagles have probably a 1-3 chance to win.
Sonny00:07:34What's been your favorite thing about watching the Eagles this year?
JVL00:07:38How unexpected it all is. You're playing with house hunting at this point. 100%. Yeah. And have been all season. I mean, they weren't supposed to be good this season to begin with. And then they were good, and then Carson Wentz goes down with a season-ending injury, and then they get better. And it has been, they're an incredibly likable team because they play, you know, like they play the right way. If you, if you watch them, what strikes you is just blocking and tackling. Like that's, they're really good at blocking and tackling. Nobody gets past the first level tackle. They give up whatever yards they're going to give up on an offensive play. And they don't allow any extra yards after the fact. And they block really well on offense.
Sonny00:08:20This is, you know, they're lunch bucket players.
JVL00:08:22Question. Yeah.
Sonny00:08:23Is there any strife at home between you and your son, who is a huge Patriots fan?
JVL00:08:28Oh, right. That's right. Interesting that you've asked that.
Sonny00:08:31I'm curious.
JVL00:08:33I believe that I may have a chance to convert him.
Sonny00:08:37Convert him to Philadelphia.
JVL00:08:40He is hanging. Well, what I did was I cut his hand off first.
Vic00:08:44You have to do it when they're young.
JVL00:08:45First, I cut his hand off, and he is now clinging to the little antenna. And I have reached down to him and said, come to me, and together we will rule the city of brotherly love together.
Sonny00:08:56No, but you've got it backwards, though, because the Patriots are the Empire. That doesn't make any sense.
JVL00:09:00The point is, he watched the game, and because my son, whom I love, is a filthy frontrunner, watching the Eagles whoop ass on the Vikings, he was like, wow, the Eagles are awesome.
Vic00:09:14But he also had seen the Pats, then.
JVL00:09:17He had seen the Pats, and he was convinced that they were going to lose. And this is what he does. It's funny. He's convinced they're going to lose until the end when he's convinced they're going to win. Yeah. And then after the game, he memory holds the entire first half meltdown of, you know. But I always had the feeling watching them, even though they were down. But I have a secret weapon. That they were going to come back. I have a secret weapon. Yes. Shannon, turn off the show. I went and ordered yesterday a Nick Foles Super Bowl LII patch jersey for Cody.
Sonny00:09:47This is not the Nike Elite.
JVL00:09:49They don't make the Nike Elite levels for youth. Oh. If they did, I would have done it. Oh. Because it would have been a bargain at twice the price to put my thumb on the scale of bringing him over to Philadelphia. Look, look. Philadelphia is poised to be good for a pretty long time here. There's a very young team, a very well-coached team. The Patriots, Tom Brady will die eventually. Same thing with Bill Belichick. Bob Kraft will die. I mean, the guy's like 90 years old or something. Once that all goes away, they're just another NFL team. It's a product of really like three or four guys. Ernie Adams, have you seen him? He could go any minute. And the Eagles will be there. So I think this is my chance to scoop my son up and force him to accept his patrimony. Question.
Sonny00:10:36Yeah. If you had to choose right now between Carson Wentz and Nick Foles going forward, who do you take? Foles. Foles.
Vic00:10:45If Foles loses the Super Bowl.
JVL00:10:48I thought you were going to ask me, do I choose between Foles and Brady going forward?
Sonny00:10:53If you had to choose between Foles and Brady going forward, what terrible, awful response would you pick?
JVL00:10:59Tom Brady is the greatest of all time. He is the GOAT. No one denies this. That said, right now, if you were drafting a quarterback to build a franchise around for the next five to ten years, Nick Foles has had a seven touchdown game. Tom Brady has only thrown six touchdown games. If Nick Foles was once the NFC player of the month, Tom Brady has never been the NFC player of the month. Never. Not once in his whole career.
Vic00:11:28He has a terrible record in the NFC.
JVL00:11:30Nick Foles has no stitches on his throwing hand. Tom Brady has 10 stitches, 10 of them, on his throwing hand.
Sonny00:11:37I'm just saying when you look at the data. Those will never heal, too. Those stitches don't heal. They may not. Forever, you have them in your hand.
JVL00:11:45For all we know, they could be there for forever. I'm just saying we don't know.
Vic00:11:50If Nick Foles.
Sonny00:11:51If you extrapolate from now, he'll have 100 stitches by next year. Next week. If he's getting 10 stitches a year. If he's getting 10 stitches a month.
Vic00:11:59If Nick Foles, if Nick Foles, if Nick Foles, everyone's interrupting me. If Nick Foles loses the Super Bowl.
Sonny00:12:05If Tom Brady doesn't have sex with Gisele Bundchen, will he still be able to win all these football games?
JVL00:12:13We don't know that, do we?
Sonny00:12:14I don't know. We don't know. We don't know. What if she leaves him?
JVL00:12:17There are a lot of questions.
Sonny00:12:17I was listening to the talk radio today, and they were talking about how the Patriots all have supermodel lives. giselle and adriana lima is with like edelman or somebody like is she with i don't know i don't know one of the one of but like she's apparently imported her whole victoria's secret brood into
JVL00:12:39this into this network it's amazing that's not how it is in philly no in philly it's all trash i got i got my cousin carmen from the south philly you'd love to meet her nick i'm sorry
Sonny00:12:51vic were you gonna say something you've you've you've wheeled away from the table turns out i You wheeled away from the table. Come back. Come and talk. Come back. Come back. Come on.
Vic00:13:02Come on.
JVL00:13:04Did Gene watch the game?
?00:13:07No.
Vic00:13:08I have no Gene this week. So did you watch it with me? My question is, if Nick Foles loses the Super Bowl, are they going to go with Carson Wentz next year? I have to get up really fast before I get interrupted.
JVL00:13:19Wow. Undoubtedly, yes. If Foles loses the Super Bowl, they go with Wentz.
Sonny00:13:24You almost stole the 18-year on the ground.
Vic00:13:26I had to go as fast as possible before I got interrupted.
JVL00:13:28I'm going to do you one better. What? I think if Foles wins the Super Bowl, they probably still go back to Carson Wentz. Well, of course they do.
Sonny00:13:36Of course they do because Carson Wentz is a better quarterback.
JVL00:13:39Really? Yes. How many, I mean, what is your sample size of games for that?
Sonny00:13:46It's not.
JVL00:13:48He looked like a better quarterback for 10 games this year.
Sonny00:13:50It's not watching Nick Foles get cut and bounced around the league. Till he's the backup again at the place he left.
JVL00:14:00I think that that could be a mistake. What they were likely to do. Question. Yes.
Sonny00:14:08Is the big loser in this playoff run so far Kirk Cousins, who is seeing his potential spots in Jacksonville and San Francisco dry up where Nick and Nick Foles is going to be a free agent after this year, is he not?
JVL00:14:24He has one more year, I believe.
Sonny00:14:25Oh, is he under contract for one more? Oh, still, though. Still, though. I think Kirk Cousins, he's seeing his potential destinations dry up.
JVL00:14:32Kirk Cousins is not a starting caliber quarterback in the National Football League.
Sonny00:14:36Kirk Cousins is going to get $30 million a year.
JVL00:14:40Okay. Somebody will pay him that, but I'm telling you, as a short-to-medium-term prospect, he is not a viable starter in the league.
Sonny00:14:47He's very solid. I agree with this. I totally agree with this. I mean, you've watched Kirk Cousins play a lot. He has solid stats. He's a totally competent quarterback who is going to get Aaron Rodgers money.
JVL00:14:59He would be a good backup. No. Look, in a team that is a playoff contending team, Kirk Cousins would be a good backup. I don't. Do you really? I'm not being a jerk. Do you really believe that? Yeah. Do you think he is a starting caliber?
Vic00:15:12If Alfred Morris and Pierre Garçon were still playing for the Redskins and a couple other dudes, I think he'd be in better shape.
Sonny00:15:18I think Kirk Cousins is a better quarterback than Nick Foles.
JVL00:15:23are you drunk not yet no i mean you're just trolling but that's no i think that's a crazy
Sonny00:15:29he's just objectively a better quarterback than that's a crazy thing he can hit the he can hit the guys and he's he's thrown his six touchdown games i mean he's basically brady level he's
JVL00:15:39thrown the six touchdown games okay right so am i wrong i might be wrong i don't know somebody will correct me on twitter i'm sure it uh so here's but here's the interesting thing so if the eagles win the super bowl which again they are more likely than not to lose i believe what happens is the eagles get dr nick riviera in there to look at carson wentz and say oh hey everybody this this acl does not look very good i think maybe we've had some complications
Sonny00:16:06with the rehab and we have to question yeah when did when did dr nick riviera become a mexican A Mexican stereotype from a 1930s Disney cartoon.
JVL00:16:22Dr. Nick Riviera has an accent.
Sonny00:16:23Yeah, but he doesn't sound like... Hello, everybody. He doesn't sound like the Frito Bandito.
Vic00:16:30He sounds like the guy from Taxi. What's his name? I'm wearing my sombrero.
Sonny00:16:35I'm Dr. Nick. That's what you sounded like just now. That's what you sounded just like now.
Vic00:16:39Who's the dead comedian that Jim Carrey made his whole life movie?
JVL00:16:44movie yeah andy kaufman it sounded like no so this is what will happen is they'll bring in a doctor to say also question have you been working on the impression before now no i just threw that
Vic00:16:54out there on the spot it was just right there for you okay i'll give you a five i'll give you a five
JVL00:16:58out of ten i will finish this and we'll move on to like talk about culture or something they will bring in a doctor and the doctor will say there have been complications with the rehab he is such a special player we got to take care of his future and we're going to slow walk this and we're going give him all the time he needs to get healthy and they're going to wait like six or eight games for foals to play in the next 2018 season to see if he's actually still playing at the same level
Sonny00:17:20before they make a decision well i mean he is going to be i mean that the the injury that went suffered is a year-long injury right i mean he will be is he going to be ready for the next
JVL00:17:29unclear unclear i would say if if they could aggressively get him ready for the start of the season they will almost certainly not do that and i suspect they'll run in the other direction and try to make it as long as possible so they can get a better read on foals
Sonny00:17:43sunny how are you i'm good it's 15 minutes of football talk that's good that's good because this is a crappy episode we're well on our way how's your weekend been my weekend has been great uh my uh my daughter had a stomach virus and then three days later my wife got the stomach virus and then i didn't get it i like this is i have i have i have magically hold on escape the cycle
Vic00:18:10of sickness and and isn't it true that you've also never gotten a cavity in your life i've
Sonny00:18:15never gotten a cavity yeah i'm basically unbreakable is what i the m9 how much how much have you tried but i i you know i just started i just started benching it and then my my my two and a half year old daughter she started she added a 45 pound plate to it and i was like whoa i can't even tell the difference here put on more and so she's put on the paint cans are you much into swimming do you like water oh i almost drowned one time is that right that's the only my one weakness water i can't believe that uh remember anyway not no sick no sickness for me and it's too bad do you work security at the vet oh god that was the vet it wasn't even the link it was eagles it was so long ago it was no no it wasn't the eagles it was like a college team it was like University of... Oh, right, but they happen to play there. Pennsylvania or something. Temple, maybe. So anyway, I'm actually really great because I'm not sick, as opposed to JBL, who is fighting off various diseases, and is double-fisting Shuffer Huffer and 18-year Johnny Watch. It's literally... Is that wrong? This is the white trashiest thing that has ever been done. I know that we shouldn't... You can mix it together? I know we shouldn't... With some Coke. I know we shouldn't make fun of the deplorables, but goddamn, this is
Vic00:19:27just... A little Coke and Johnny Walker
JVL00:19:3018, that's how I roll. You elites in your Georgetown cocktail parties.
Sonny00:19:34I don't go to Georgetown cocktail parties. I only go to Washington, D.C. in like 14th Street cocktail parties. I don't even know what that is. That's very hipster-like. 14th Street's where the... I don't go to cocktail parties. Nobody goes to cocktail parties. They go to cocktail bars. You go to a cocktail bar and you have your drinks. You don't go to the cocktail party. Nobody wants to host those. Nobody's holding a salon? The only person who hosts those is Peter Suderman And he doesn't listen to this, so it doesn't matter. So, like, you know, it doesn't matter. Nobody goes to those. Okay.
Vic00:20:03Quick story on the bathroom renovation. Oh, how's that going? Yes, well, we're almost done. I think we'll be done by the end of this week. So Kate was very excited. She said to come down and check out the bathroom because they put all the marble in the tile. Everything is coming together really nicely. So we go down there, check it out. But there was no toilet yet.
Sonny00:20:19Wait, is it the marble in the tile that you got from Lowe's?
Vic00:20:24I don't know what it is It's not marble Is it like a white granite For the vanity It's gray and I don't know Here's a question, is it natural stone or manufactured I couldn't tell you, Kate could tell you actually She knows all the specs Did she design and pick out everything In your bathroom And I looked at it and I said that looks good to me Your bathroom, the bathroom that is going to be your office She designed everything Well I mean she showed me what they thought and she liked and I said I like it and I didn't disagree with her I think she should get to destroy it first I mean it's fine I mean when I knew we were in college I didn't think she did it at all right and it's one of those things you know it's a mystery what you do that okay sorry that's a scene in the
Sonny00:21:10big sick where she actually has to the female character actually she wakes up at like two in the morning and she's running around the apartment that she's staying she's staying overnight at it kimono kimono's place and uh she has to she has to and she and she like is like hey i'm gonna run down to the 7-eleven for some coffee real quick i'll be right back and he's like i've got coffee right here no i just want to get you know like a like a soda or something he's like i've got so
Vic00:21:36i gotta poop yeah it's shocking i think she says something other than yeah it's shocking i i always thought it would just be like a ball of dust you know just okay but anyway so she's directly into heaven yeah yes exactly no so i said jbl welcome back thank you i snarfed my chauffeur that was so funny the uh so we were looking at it and the toilet's not there yet right so it's just a hole they cover it it's just a hole so it's i'm not even gonna make a joke i was leave it there i was gonna make a joke and i'm not gonna make a joke because it would offend a lot of just squat so yes so i said oh and so we're looking at it but a hose quietly quietly and all of a sudden we hear this like moving noise underneath where the hole is for the toilet it's like a scratching noise Yeah Sonny's face He's shaking his head Nope And it sounds heavy It doesn't sound like a man It sounds heavy Which movie is this? And remember This connects Is this Tremors? I don't know but it's true Alligator? And it connects to the main sewer So all of a sudden You actually see The plastic covering Starts moving I kid you not So immediately I yell at Kate Quick get something to cover this And so she was running around And I'm trying to find ways To fit it on this thing But I'm like I don't think it's gonna get underneath And we finally settled on my idea which was Tupperware and a weight on top so I've got a 25 30 foot alligator coming out well it's an alligator will have a serious problem but I said if it's anything else this might do it and so Pennywise it was yes anyway yeah he was working his way up and I said if so she's I said there's like a 25 pound dumbbell and so she went she's like yeah she had hurt her back I can't lift it so running over put it down it's
Sonny00:23:14And Vic ran over and was like, I can't lift this either. We've got to get Bill Dwyer over here. We've got to get Captain Bill.
Vic00:23:2025 is right in my range. 25 is right in my range.
Sonny00:23:23And then four hours later, after the rat had run out and run all around the place and gone back, and the whole Bill Dwyer came over, and he put the Captain Bill.
Vic00:23:31You know, it's terrifying. These things can eat through anything. But luckily, it didn't, because this happened to David Skinner during a renovation. They were renovating windows, and they left the door open, and had gotten in. And so they set up, our friend David Skinner, they set up a giant rat trap. In the middle of the night, Skinner hears the big snap noise. He goes down. It had only partially hit the rat. And the rat was dragging the trap with it and then had to kill it. And it's disgusting. But, you know, as my barber, Habib, says, you know, who's from Morocco, he said that his father killed a rat the size of his forearm. He said he trapped it in the bathroom, and in Habib's exact words, he killed it with a chair. It screamed like baby.
?00:24:18Oh, God.
Sonny00:24:20Yeah, that's okay. I'm sorry.
JVL00:24:21That's worse than my Dr. Nick impression.
Sonny00:24:23Well, that's how he said it. That's way worse than my rat story. That's horrifying.
Vic00:24:27What's your rat story, Sonny?
Sonny00:24:29When I lived in southeast Washington, D.C., I lived next to an alley. And at a certain point in living there, I realized that there were, at the very least, large mice running around. And I put down some traps, and I caught one mouse. Outside or inside? Inside. I caught one mouse, but there were still things running around in the walls. So I put, like, four packs of poison down. And just like, you know, the big blocks of poison. I just put that down. I was like, here you go. Here you go, rats or mice or whatever. And it stopped. And the motion in the walls stopped, the scratching noises, et cetera, it all stopped. And about four months later, on the first hot day of summer, the hot day of summer, first hot day of summer, I noticed a fly, you know, like a little black house fly. It was in my house. I was like, oh, gross. Which is rare, because I lived, again, I lived in a, I didn't say this, I lived in a, like an English basement. So I was underground, no windows or anything. Very rarely did I get bugs down there, which was nice. Like, no water bugs or anything.
Vic00:25:41I've seen basements like that. They're kind of a fire trap, aren't they?
Sonny00:25:44Oh, 100% of my... Well, I had two exits, so I would have been okay, probably. Oh, you have two exits. Okay, but no windows. But no windows. If I had died, I would have gotten happy.
JVL00:25:52Boy, your single life sounds like it was just a cavalcade of wonders. Why did you ever get married?
Sonny00:25:56Yeah, I know. So there was a fly, and I was like, oh, that's weird and gross. So I killed the fly, and then about a minute later, I saw another one. I was like, I just killed you, so I killed that one. And then I saw two flies, and I was like, something's wrong. Something's gone horribly wrong. And then I saw 30 flies. And they were just pouring out of the vent, the air vent in my bathroom. Because whatever I had killed with that poison had died in the walls. And now it was the host to endless black house flies. A prodigy video. And I left the basement, and I gathered myself, and I went to the Safeway across the street. Were you crying? No. No, I was just grossed out. And I bought what I would say is...
JVL00:26:39More poison for flies.
Sonny00:26:40I bought maybe 15 canisters of sprays of various sorts. And I just started spraying them into the fan. And I turned the vent on and I was like, take all this!
JVL00:26:51Take it all! And I put a sock over my nose and I was like, no, I'm not going to breathe this in. You're going to breathe it in. You're going to breathe it in.
Sonny00:26:57And I may have lost like 10 IQ points that day, but it was worth it. Because I killed all... And it was...
JVL00:27:03I mean, they were literally just falling.
Sonny00:27:05You know that scene in The Matrix where they shoot, in The Matrix Revolutions, where they shoot off the EMP in the cave and all the things start falling out of, the squiddies start falling out of the sky. That's what it was like with the flies. They just started dropping out of the sky. And I was like, ah, well, this worked. It worked. I've never used poison again since then.
JVL00:27:29No, no, no.
Vic00:27:30And you have MS now, but that's okay.
Sonny00:27:33Well, it's fine. It's treatable. how long before you moved like two years oh my god that's horrifying i lived there for i lived i lived in that basement apartment until i moved in with my wife uh and i loved that if i if if i had to do it all over again i would do it exactly the same it was great it was a basement part it was a basement apartment in the heart of washington dc on capitol hill and it was like 800 bucks a
Vic00:27:57month it was great i lived in the kennedy warren pj o'rourke and uh mandy grunwald and uh and coulter and i shared jeff rose everybody lived there everybody lived there i shared a washing
Sonny00:28:15machine with the teacher upstairs oh intriguing not a hot one okay you could have left it at that
Vic00:28:21uh but it's a jungle out there and speaking of jungles over the weekend jumanji welcome to the Oh, by the way, how many more transitions to Welcome to Jumanji do I have to do?
Sonny00:28:30I don't know. It's not stopping. I was talking about this with J-Pod over the weekend, who wrote a piece for the Weekly Standard, I believe, about how Jumanji and The Greatest Showman have been huge word of mouth successes. But Jumanji is going to do a multiple of 10. I mean, so quickly, the multiple is the like figure that you say about if a movie does $40 million on its opening weekend and it does $400 million at the end of its run, it did a multiple of 10. Jumanji is going to do a multiple of about 10. It's going to gross about $360, $370 million off a $36 million opening weekend. And that's huge because what it means is people are saying week to week, we got to go see this. We got to go. I haven't seen it yet. Nobody in this room has seen it. We are pop culture mavens, and we have not seen the most impressive piece of pop culture.
Vic00:29:22It's making a mint, probably, for Jack Black.
Guest00:29:26He doesn't have to work.
Vic00:29:29So that took the top spot at the box office with $20 million. It's now grossed over $316 million domestic.
JVL00:29:36Do we think Rampage is going to do as well as Jumanji? No.
Vic00:29:39Is it based on the game?
JVL00:29:41Yeah. You didn't see the ads for it during the football games? With Dwayne Johnson. With The Rock. The Rock goes from Jumanji to Rampage. Very different movies.
Sonny00:29:52As our friend Matt Cotton Eddy said, he was actually a little bit confused because he didn't understand why The Rock is in another movie with giant animals.
JVL00:29:58I had the same thought myself.
Sonny00:30:00So there's some confusion there. It's by the guy who directed San Andreas, which is not a good sign because that movie was a bit of a bomb.
Vic00:30:07Was it in that movie too? Was it in that movie too or no?
JVL00:30:09I thought you guys loved San Andreas. No. Oh, I loved Alexandria.
Sonny00:30:14Yeah. I actually had a hard time watching that movie because she is just like pure sex on the screen it was in IMAX and it was just like it was actually like uncomfortable to watch I was like she should put some clothes on there are kids here this is a PG-13 movie
JVL00:30:32so if you had seen that when you were like 12 or 13
Sonny00:30:36I would have watched that movie a hundred times if I was 12 years old when San Andreas came out well first I'd watch I probably actually wouldn't because I would just be watching Pornhub or whatever. Whatever the 12-year-olds watch now. What? What is that? I don't know. I assume that's what the kids watch.
JVL00:30:54Stormy Daniels.
Vic00:30:56I'm just flummoxed. It's the blue episode, guys. It's the blue episode. It's the platinum label episode. Speaking of which, I loved Blue Lagoon. Speaking of which, I loved Blue Lagoon. That was my movie, but I never knew how it ended. Okay. I love that. That's a deep cut. It's a deep cut because, you know. That's an, we, you have done that joke before on the show. It kills every time. I recycle, I recycle. And it kills every time. We've got episode 61, we're recycling, and it kills every time. Every time. I'm like Midge Maisel here. Okay, in second. Oh, that's a new cut. That's a new cut. Beth and I just started watching that show. We should talk about it. We should do an episode. We should talk about Midge Maisel, and we'll bring in pot. Yeah. Okay. In second place was 12 Strong, with $16.5 million, and this is the movie with Mark Wahlberg, right? Oh, no. No.
Sonny00:31:45That was Lone Survivor. Lone Survivor.
Vic00:31:47Okay. One only, sadly, I feel like we all should watch it, but only Sonny has watched it thus far. Do you need me to do my read first?
JVL00:31:5512 Strong. Or do you want me to slide this elsewhere?
Sonny00:31:57Yeah, what if we did an ad read? We're at 32 minutes.
JVL00:32:00Yeah, what's going on, JVL? You know what's strong? What's strong is my oral hygiene game. Philly Strong. My oral hygiene game is awfully strong. When it comes to your health, brushing your teeth is one of the most important parts of your day. Quip knows that. They've combined dentistry and design to make a better electric toothbrush. Quip is the new electric toothbrush that packs just the right amount of vibrations into a slimmer design at a fraction of the cost of bulkier traditional electric brushes. And guiding pulses alert you when to switch sides, making brushing the right amount of effortless. Quip also comes with a mount that suctions right onto your mirror and then unsticks to use as a cover for hygienic travel anywhere. That's actually how I use mine. And whether it's going in your gym bag or your carry-on, it's always there for you. And because the thing that cleans your mouth should also be clean, Quip's subscription plan refreshes your brush on a dentist-recommended schedule. They deliver a new brush head every three months for just $5, including free shipping worldwide. Quip is backed by a network of over 10,000 dental professionals, including dentists, hygienists, and dental students. Most toothbrushes don't get named one of Time Magazine's Best Inventions of the Year, but Quip did. You should find out why for yourself today. I use Quip. It's my travel toothbrush of choice. It's fantastic. Now, Quip starts at just $25, and if you go to getquip.com slash substandard right now, not five minutes from now, right now, You'll get your first refill pack for free with a Quip electric toothbrush. That's your first refill pack free at getquip.com slash substandard. Spelled G-E-T-Q-U-I-P dot com slash substandard.
Vic00:33:50Lovely, JVL. That was a strong read. Now, how about a review of 12 Strong?
Sonny00:33:5412 Strong. So, 12 Strong, which has a terrible name. Can we discuss this? Can we discuss this for a second? This name tells you nothing. When I say 12 Strong to you, what do you guys think of? What do you think of? I say, just go right now. 12 Strong, first word.
Vic00:34:09Thunder from Down Under, the male strip show. Jesus.
Sonny00:34:14Tells me way more about Vic than I needed to know. JBL, you go. You go, 12 Strong.
JVL00:34:19It's a salad dressing, but I don't want to use it.
Sonny00:34:21Okay, 12 Strong, I think like Seahawks. I think like, I think football or, you know, the 12th man. 12 Strong is actually about the horse soldiers of Afghanistan. And if you had just called the movie Horse Soldiers, I think you would have been in a much better position here. It is a very straightforward...
JVL00:34:39Is this a prequel to 13 Hours?
Sonny00:34:40It's a very straightforward retelling of America's first actions in Afghanistan. It's about a special forces team that is inserted into country about a month after 9-11 that joins up with the Northern Alliance to take out the Taliban and al-Qaeda in Mazar al-Sharif. It is, it is a, it's a, it is, it's a very well done movie. It is a, I, I, I have no, uh, objections to large portions of it. Um, there are a few little things here and there. The, for instance, you get a lot of repeated dialogue. I, you keep being told the same plans two or three times and that gets a little annoying, but as a piece of filmmaking, it is, it is very well done. It's a very action oriented. puts you into the the middle of the combat and it it like it it drives home the point of what this conflict is all about which is removing uh medieval pestilence from a uh mountain strewn uh desert hole um and i look i i liked it chris hemsworth plays the kind of the lead of the team he's better known as thor he is great michael shannon who is one of our one of our finest character actors working today he's also in shape of water which recently received 13 nominations uh at the at the oscars uh is he plays uh the chief warrant officer he's like the the top enlisted guy he's he's out there kind of helping the helping chris hemsworth through the thing i look it's it's it's a fine movie it is a very straightforward um uh american war movie and i i strongly recommend it to anybody who is like into that sort of thing it is it is even more straightforward than a movie like say american sniper or um something like that there's no questioning the mission here this is a this is a this is a movie about rooting out evil and uh taking out uh bad guys so this is not like stop loss with ryan philippe is what you're saying it's not like stop loss it's not like uh it's not like brothers is it brothers was that the movie brothers it's not like brothers it's not like zero dark 30 it's not a movie about like questioning why we're there it is just it is a straightforward reminder that there is evil in the world and it needs to be taken out and i'm and i'm like you know ross douthat uh about 10 years ago now actually wrote a piece for the atlantic that was very good it was very much about uh the what how how what hollywood had produced after 9-11 did not actually match up with what people thought hollywood was going to produce after 9-11 and the way he kind of framed this piece was like look we thought we were going to get a bunch of movies like tears of the sun and instead we got a bunch of movies like green zone and it is it is it is it is a movie that is uh and this is this movie 12 strong uh uh is very much in the mold of tears of the sun it's about kind of american righteousness in the face of uh uh terror and horror and that was bruce willis movie bruce willis movie i i watched it again this weekend actually because to prep for this because i hadn't seen it in a long time and it is the most neocon movie ever made it's like the most liberal interventionist neocon movie ever made it literally the closing uh the closing title card is the edmund burke the quote the only uh what is the only the only yeah what is it evil can only try if good men do nothing whatever that whatever that line is uh and it is this is this is much in that in that moment so so not syriana
Vic00:38:12it's not syriana not three kings men who stare at ghosts not three kings okay would that have
JVL00:38:17been different sunny do you think had al gorban president i you know there maybe it's possible
Sonny00:38:25this is not a leading question i don't know i i i well so the the the flip side to this is i think that since ross wrote that piece actually since like 2007 2008 i don't know what happened after 2008 why we would be more interested in having positive portrayals of you know the the u.s military and and that sort of thing but i do think that after that was an olympic year after 2008 you you did see a a larger number of kind of more straightforward uh tales of american heroism uh abroad movies like lone survivor which you mentioned um american sniper you know and and and i i look i i think that uh i the the al gore question is a very interesting one and i don't know i don't know quite how to answer it because i also think al gore would have handled post 9-11 very differently than george bush did yeah agreed so i you know i don't know if we have the iraq war We will certainly have the Afghanistan War. That still happens. But what the aftermath of that looks like.
JVL00:39:31Remember the first big war movie to come out post 9-11? Black Hawk Down? No. I'm going to guess. The Kingdom. Oh. It was made pre-9-11, and it came out about a month afterwards. Oh. Behind enemy lines. Oh. And that movie came out of nowhere to make a ton of money because people wanted a war movie. at that time, and it wasn't meant to be an Iraq movie. It isn't in Iraq movies anyway. But it did really well.
Vic00:39:59And it was also very, it was pro. That was a pro-American movie. Gene Hackman.
Sonny00:40:04Once again, it's in this kind of Tears of the Sun mode, which Tears of the Sun comes out in 2003, which is long enough that it was probably in gestation before 9-11 even happened. It's very much a movie about the Rwandan genocide, and kind of the American non-response to that, and regrets about the american non-response to that but this is very much in that mode of like kind of like america is a force for good in the world and needs to you know be there to stop these genocidal crazy
Vic00:40:32maniacs were you a big fan uh at the time well no you would have been really young at the time go
Sonny00:40:38ahead i'm sorry can i just was that was that like the initial entry in the owen wilson action star oh genre or was or was i'll effort that while you guys talk though because because this is i i i probably saw that movie on hbo about 20 times that summer i just i just watched it over and over again and uh and it also has the the the uh the guy from clear and present danger who's like the the colombian um shanghai noon is a year before oh shanghai so shanghai noon was first
JVL00:41:07yeah but this was you're saying the colombian no the the uh the guy the guy in uh clear and
Sonny00:41:12present danger who kills the secretary oh yeah that guy yeah he's like he's like the head of
JVL00:41:17The machine's still on. He's French, actually, I think. Is that right? The actor, I believe the actor is French. I'll look this up.
Sonny00:41:24Anyway, he is in this as like the head of NATO or something. Okay. And it's like, I just remember. That's right.
JVL00:41:30He can play anything.
Vic00:41:32Another great war movie executive decision with Kurt Russell in the hijacking of the plane. Is that really a war movie? I don't think that's a war movie. But remember, that movie came out. We thought it was a Steven Seagal. People thought it was a Steven Seagal movie. Yeah. And the most surprising thing, of course, was when he dies in the first three movies of the movie. Very surprising. Portuguese. Joaquin Dalmada. Oh, there you go. Yes, he's great in Clear and Present Danger, by the way. Great. Joaquin Dalmada. He's great in everything. He should be in more movies. Were you a big Vietnam War movie guy when those movies started to come out?
Sonny00:42:03Well, so the Vietnam War movie genre is kind of instructive, right? Because you had Full Metal Jacket, which came out in 1980, I think. Oh, no, later. No, later. - '86, '86, '87, which is like kind of, well, so what, you had "Platoon" and "Full Metal Jacket" and "Casualties of War" all come out within like three years of each other.
JVL00:42:27- "Hamburger Hill," all at the same time. - And it was, it's this weird mix of like very anti-war and like kind of, you know.
Sonny00:42:37- Love the troops, hate the-- - Well, but not even love the troops though, right? Because like, I mean, "Platoon" is very much a movie about hating the troops. It's very much about how there are bad troops and casualties of war, especially as a movie about bad troops. I mean, it's so I Hollywood doesn't quite know what to do with these wars as they're in motion, which is a problem for everything post 9-11, because we've been at war for the last 17 years now. And like, I don't know what I you know, I don't know how they the balancing that is is a very tough thing to do.
Vic00:43:14I remember, I think, the first of the Vietnam movies to come out in the 70s was M.A.S.H., and they couldn't even have it about Vietnam. It was ostensibly Korea. Right. But everybody knew that it was essentially M.A.S.H., and then, of course, Apocalypse Now.
JVL00:43:30Vic, which war do you think has the best filmography?
Vic00:43:36World War II, Korea, Vietnam? I love World War II movies. So you and I went to see Saving Private Ryan, and we've had this discussion on the episode already once before, because it was a screener, so there weren't a lot of people there, but some people had to get up and leave and walk around. Do you remember this? It was very intense for a lot of the older people at the time, and this is more than 20, this is what, something almost 20 years ago, so these people were, a lot of them might have been vets, and somebody brought their kid. Do you remember this? Oh, yeah. That was a mistake. And then you went on later on that day to see... Something About Mary. Yes. That was a weird double feature. Good double feature. It's a weird double feature. But you're a World War II guy? I do. And I mean, even the movies that came out in the 70s, such as Battle of Midway, I think is a fantastic movie. And I love the movies where, and Patton for that matter, where one of my pet peeves is when you're seeing the enemy, if you're seeing the Axis and they're speaking in English because it makes it easier for the listeners. I prefer for, you know, I'd rather read subtitles. Subtitles. Yeah, because it feels like more realistic in my opinion. You just like hearing German. You know, das stimmt.
Sonny00:44:51I mean, no, no, no. I mean, that's true. But you know what? Civil War. Civil War underrated as a war for films. Underrated as a war for films. War for films. War for films. You know, you've got Gettysburg. Glory. Glory, and Gods and Generals, and of course, Lincoln, and I'll tell you, Gangs of New York, kind of, is weirdly-
Vic00:45:16Yeah, Draft Riots, Draft Riots. I will say this, I remember a movie- The Beguiled, both versions. The movie Taps. Do you remember this movie?
Sonny00:45:28Is that the one with, that's the one with Tom Cruise?
Vic00:45:30Yes, and he wasn't even top billing at the time, of course. It was a Timothy Hutton vehicle. Timothy Hutton, he had already done Ordinary People, and so he did this movie with George C. Scott and Sean Penn about the taking over, where the kids take over the military academy, right? And it was obviously very explicitly anti-war, anti-military, you know, kids getting killed, and, you know, what is this teaching our kids, right? And it originally starts as a fight between the townies and the military academy kids who are like high school and maybe junior high. But for me as a kid watching it, the takeaway was not how awful war is. It's like, I want to join and wear uniforms and guns.
Sonny00:46:17I'm just going to throw this out there. I'm going to throw this out there. Toy soldiers, greater sign, tapped, taps. Toy soldiers with Robin Williams? No, no, no. No, that's Toys. Oh, that's Toys. That's Toys. Toy Soldiers is the one with Will Wheaton and Sean Astin, and the drug lords, the Colombian drug lords come up and take over the military school. Remember that one? That one is great.
JVL00:46:40I vaguely remember that. That's a great idea. So was Red Dawn talking back to Taps? So Taps is 1981, Red Dawn's 1984. Is that in part a response to Taps?
Sonny00:46:52I don't know. I never really thought of that. No, I don't think that's true. I mean, Red Dawn is very much in response to all of... I mean, Red Dawn is a very weird movie if you go back and watch it because it is very much a movie that is in sympathy with the Viet Cong, but also very much in sympathy... What? You just blew my mind. No, but very much in sympathy with the... I know what you're saying. you know rebels in Afghanistan and very much in sympathy with the kind of right wing idea of like resistance of you know guns are the fundamental force of freedom I mean like this is it has it puts a bunch of different ideas together in interesting ways that are I don't think ever fully examined or appreciated that's a favorite war movie of all time
Vic00:47:46you know what put me on the spot over here and there are aspects of Saving Private Ryan that I like very much I loved Tom Sizemore as Sergeant Mike Horvath but I can't watch when Adam Goldberg is slowly stabbed in the heart as the German is telling him don't worry it'll be over soon don't try to resist it I can't watch that it's easier to watch the storming of D-Day in the beginning than it is to watch that Empire of the Sun
JVL00:48:17Empire of the Sun okay Sonny favorite war movie ever unless you have a ranking of war movies
Sonny00:48:24I have a ranking of post 9-11 but I will I'll get to that my favorite of all time is probably Pat great movie I love Pat I love the speech at the beginning I love the just the kind of pomposity of it I love I love the great man theory of history I believe that the blood of history is driven by the voices of insane people so like the idea of of Patton watching Rommel get routed oh you magnificent bastard I read your book that's like I that is like the idea of history to me very good Sonny um so Patton I
JVL00:48:59would say very nice JBL yeah you know I didn't really think about the question before I started I might say Starship Troopers oh weirdly enough yeah yeah great movie which is a war movie not
Sonny00:49:09a sci-fi I mean it's a sci-fi movie but it is a it's an anti-war movie it's like a is it yes well They are right to kill the bugs It was intended as a critique of the kind of Fascist propaganda movies
Vic00:49:21You mean Heinlein at the time meant it that way No no no
Sonny00:49:24Paul Verhoeven Paul Verhoeven Who has his own reasons to be Annoyed with it
JVL00:49:32But my family was shelled by By the allies But it was friendly fire We may have discussed this on the show
Sonny00:49:41But the commentary track on the original DVD cut
JVL00:49:44Where he talks about his family being shelled by the Allies during the war.
Sonny00:49:47But it was friendly fire. It was friendly fire. I believe he calls out Stephen Hunter or somebody from the Washington Post. For 20 minutes. He's like, I can't believe that Stephen Hunter would say that this is, you know.
JVL00:49:59Stephen Hunter rented space inside his head. Yes, fantastic. And his essay on it wasn't a review. Like, he wrote like 2,000 words, which for a, you know, newspaper movie review is amazing. about and just took the movie apart in ways which I don't fully agree with, but which was a great
Sonny00:50:15essay. I actually totally disagree with the way he wrote about the movie, but I thought it was a great essay. And Stephen Hunter's collection, which is something the Valencia, we can put it in show notes. But his collection, which you can find on Amazon, is extremely good and extremely well worth reading. And it's fascinating to read as a document of a newspaper critic writing long form essays and reviews in the last era where that is possible like it is it just doesn't happen anymore you don't see you don't see it except for like wesley morris writing in the new york times dot com uh for for two thousand words on whatever or sunny bunch writing on the free beacon dot com well i'm a well it doesn't that's a post 9-11 war yes yes moving right ranked i'm just going to throw this out there okay number five is a bit of a cheat because it was done before 9-11 even actually happen but it is strangely resonant in the time after 9-11 blackhawk down oh love black hawk down released december of 2011 great movie is a movie that is very much in conversation with what is happening in the world at the time despite being done well before any of that that was over uh and it is a it is a fascinating movie to look at from that perspective but it's also just a great
Vic00:51:30war film in and of you know at at a glance i thought it was about the british army since
Sonny00:51:34there were so many it was very funny so this is it's very it's very much an anti-war movie it is very much a movie about the dangers of getting yourself involved in quiet fires and whatever but i remember i watched it for the first time in i want to say it was like march or no it must have been it must have been the summer of 2002 because i saw it uh on my friend's dvd player at home after college you know we were watching it in the summer and i was just like god damn i want to go to war and kill all those mfers who's the somali warlord the guy with the
JVL00:52:03sunglasses who explains the facts of life that's the key scene
Vic00:52:07that is the key scene and it's not ID'd because they're going after ID'd so anyway that's I love that movie Jeremy Piven great helicopter
Sonny00:52:15pilot well every there are a hundred young actors Orlando Bloom who are just in it Orlando Bloom who's in it just so he can fall out of the helicopter this is right before he was in Lord of the Rings yeah and Jason Isaacs Jason Isaacs crazy Bill. Tom Sizemore. Bill Fickner. Bill Fickner. Bill Fickner's in it. Bill. Josh Hartnett. Who? Eric Bana. This is Eric Bana's best performance. Eric Bana, where are they now?
JVL00:52:45Hoot.
Sonny00:52:46Number four, Tears of the Sun, which again, this is the opposite of Black Hawk Down. This is the movie that's like, America has to go do these things because nobody else will, and if we don't, they're literally going to cut the tits off of people. That's the thing that happens in the movie it's bad uh number three 300 i'm gonna throw that out there 300 as a post 9-11 movie as a post 9-11 movie it is a movie that was reviled by critics at the time because it was uh it was seen as kind of a fascist imperialist you know we need to go to war with iran sort of movie uh but as neil stevenson the great sci-fi author put it at the time critics just didn't understand that as it is a they couldn't understand it because it was not a movie steeped irony in an ironic age it is a movie that is about duty and honor and loyalty etc etc and it is also filmed with the greatest precision that sack snyder has ever has like this is his masterpiece
JVL00:53:41in very real ways okay can we circle back for one moment yes do you guys know that tom hardy was in blackhawk town yes did you know that the african warlord we were just talking about was george Harris who would later go on to you would know him from Harry Potter you would know him from Layer Cake
Sonny00:53:58Layer Cake the Layer Cake guy
Vic00:54:00and Mr. Katanga from Raiders of the Lost Ark yes I killed it
JVL00:54:04that's him I didn't recognize him under the sunglasses it's an amazing performance and now that I've seen it of course that's him giving that performance
Sonny00:54:13number two Zero Dark Thirty which is the best movie about the if we look at the post 9-11 cinematic landscape as a world of triumphs and defeats, Zero Dark Thirty is most interesting as what happens after. And what happens after is emptiness. And this is the crashing last shot of the movie, which is just Jessica Chastain crying on that airplane because she has done what she needed to do and now she has nothing left. And what goes after that?
Vic00:54:49Also, by the way, and great performance as Leon Panetta.
Sonny00:54:53James Gandolfini.
Vic00:54:54Yes, and who plays Dennis McDonough, who is the National Security Advisor for Obama?
Sonny00:54:59Oh, is it Coach?
Vic00:55:02Lord Halifax, and also Stannis Baratheon. Stephen Delaney. Oh, Stephen Delaney. Yeah, he's very good.
Sonny00:55:09He's a real jerk, but go ahead. Who does Kyle, what's his name? Oh, yeah, Kyle Chandler. Yeah, Kyle Chandler play. Awesome, great guy. And number one, Inglourious Bastards, just a great, great movie. Just as a piece of filmmaking, just a great, great film.
JVL00:55:24Is that about war or is that about cinema? It's both.
Vic00:55:27Yeah. It's both.
JVL00:55:28And then in the end, he lights it on fire.
Sonny00:55:31It is, well, I have a whole thing on Inglourious Bastards that one day I will write, but it is a movie that is about how movies have been used to demonize Nazis throughout history for good reason like the the the real lesson of inglorious bastards is the nazis not only lose the war they lose the history because you know who writes the history of world war ii oh i i know that the the victors the victors you know who the victors were i don't know that one the jews in hollywood and they they made the nazis look wow yes evil for for literally i mean i i you know So, anyway, Inglourious Basterds.
JVL00:56:14Eli Roth.
Sonny00:56:16I can't wait for his Death Wish.
Vic00:56:17Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Sonny00:56:19I already have. That's kind of a...
JVL00:56:21Hmm. Hmm. What? You've seen it already?
Sonny00:56:25No, but it comes out in, like, two months. I'm excited to see it.
Vic00:56:27I can't believe it's only sold two months. The Bruce Willis Death Wish? I feel like I lose track of these things. Written by Joe Carnahan. Yeah. Well, there you go. Good.
Sonny00:56:35So, anyway, do you guys have any post-9-11? Or are we out of time? We're out of time.
Vic00:56:38I'm a fan of Zero Dark for 30. I like The Kingdom with Peter Berg.
Sonny00:56:42Oh, The Kingdom is great. It's a good one.
Vic00:56:44There is a little equivalence at the end. I understand.
Sonny00:56:47It is two hours of a great movie that is tarnished by about two minutes at the end. That's exactly right at the end. Exactly right.
Vic00:56:53Okay. I guess we should move on. Let's talk about the spirit of the week that we've been much touting for the last two days. It's a Johnny Walker 18, 18 years blended scotch whiskey courtesy of our friends at Diageo. So thank you again. And it really tasted like very smooth caramel notes. I thought it was lovely. So much so, I think JVL loved it and will hopefully help him. I loved it. Nurse him back to health.
JVL00:57:19This is the greatest thing ever. Wonderful.
Vic00:57:21Okay, worse than your academic impression. Okay. I love you, Rick. Thank you. Okay, I do have a correction here.
JVL00:57:28Eagles forever.
Vic00:57:30According to substandard listener, the Nickachu. Going to the Super Bowl. We said There Will Be Blood was Paul Thomas Anderson's most expensive movie, but it's actually Magnolia. And I know why. All the frogs.
JVL00:57:44Yeah. The frogs. They were practical. They were not CGI. Oh, no. You got real frogs and a lot of frogs die. Rubber frogs. Oh, rubber. Because you can't. The PETA people would have been very unhappy if you had used real frogs.
Vic00:57:57I feel like it was probably a metaphor or something. Vic, do you know what those were?
JVL00:58:00I'm going to blow your mind. Point Pleasant. You go to Point Pleasant. You're on the boardwalk. There's the game where you bang the mallet and the rubber frog flips up.
Vic00:58:08Have you ever played that game, JVL? 100%.
JVL00:58:13How successful? Me, not at all. My brother is an idiot savant at that game. Because it's rotating.
Vic00:58:21You can't just hit it.
JVL00:58:23It's not strength. When we would go to the boardwalk, he'd just take five bucks. And I would say his success rate on that is about 80%. That's insane. And he would drive the people working the machine. He would just sit there waiting, waiting. waiting, bam. I'm much
Vic00:58:37better at the whack-a-mole game. I'm very frenetic. Oh, a mole.
JVL00:58:41A mole. Okay, right. Sorry. I gotta jump the gun there. I'm really good at that. I'm really fast with my hands. Okay. Sonny has no idea what we're talking about because you've never been to a boardwalk, have you? It's near the sand. It's near the sand.
Vic00:58:54And it's outside. He wouldn't go. No, he wouldn't go. That's too bad for him. Let's move on. Okay. Oh, by the way, here's a really quick tip for our listeners. You learn something every time the game with the claw right i hear it depends the story is it depends on how many quarters are in the machine and when it reaches the maximum amount like okay there's a lot of money in the machine then the claw works that's what somebody said who has knowledge about how the machines work really supposedly yeah is this from one of your connected friends no comment that's all the time we're giving to this episode questions comments complaints compliments tweet us at victorina mattis at sunny bunch at jv last again be sure to subscribe to us on itunes or google play just type in substandard on the podcast and we're there leave a review tell your friends until next time
JVL00:59:40oh great well now that i'm sending it i'll have to delete it but it's easier for me to find the break you can delete well you can also delete when i blow out the speakers when i'm kidding that was the best part of the show.
Vic00:59:58I don't know. It's going to be too loud. Do you have... I'll take as I have. I got nothing. Okay. JV, do you have something? I have nothing. Okay. You ready for this? I'm going to crawl under my desk and die as soon as this is over. Well, on a sad note, I wanted to quickly send my condolences to my sister and her family. On Sunday night, Diamond, the family guinea pig, passed away.
JVL01:00:19Oh. Yes. You didn't even mention him.
Vic01:00:22I did to my sister when she was visiting. I said, how is Diamond doing? Is she still alive? And then, like, the next day, she died. I kid you not.
JVL01:00:30His power is growing, Sonny. What are we going to do?
Sonny01:00:33My God. My God, man. We need to use this for the powers of good. Say Kim Jong-un right now. Kim Jong-un.
Guest01:00:42I'm sure it'll be fine.
Spot something wrong in this episode? Suggest a correction →
Comments
Loading…