#356. 'Masters of the Universe' (1987)
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The gang tackles the 1987 Golan-Globus curio Masters of the Universe, starring Dolph Lundgren as He-Man and Frank Langella as Skeletor, with Sonny leading the charge: he calls it a cheap-button blender of Superman, Star Wars, and Conan the Barbarian that's boring for a long Earthbound stretch but ultimately, unlike the just-released 2026 reboot, unembarrassed to be exactly what it is — and he still prefers it for that sincerity. JVL agrees it never rises to the fun-camp level of Flash Gordon (nobody's having a Brian Blessed-style ball with it), while Mike, watching for the first time with almost zero He-Man background, admits he genuinely enjoyed its cheap, mysterious world-building despite conceding every plot point the others mock. JVL then delivers an extended, gleeful lecture on the real-world origin of He-Man as a Reagan-era FCC deregulation and Mattel's fear of losing the Star Wars toy aisle to Kenner, including the Filmation animation shortcuts (Orko was originally "Gwyndal") that explain why the property never had the staying power of Transformers or G.I. Joe. Before any of that, the episode opens with its usual long banter stretch: Mike welcomes listeners solo as Sonny and JVL join partway through, JVL mourns his son Flash's high school graduation by shopping for a pinball machine or watch to fill the emotional hole, Sonny recounts an exploding kitchen sink sprayer he fixed for $25 instead of a feared $400+ repair, and Mike tells the story of his son making the Little League all-star team via a mysterious yard sign delivered at 9:30 pm. They also run through box office numbers (Backrooms opening huge, Obsession holding like E.T., Mandalorian and Grogu collapsing 70%), and close with a tangent ranking Leprechaun franchise entries and grousing about ads interrupting free movies on Prime.
From the show notes
Look, say what you will, but that's a good costume design.
Full transcript
Guest00:00:00Sub-Beacon, a podcast on movies and pop culture hosted by Sonny Bunch, Jonathan V. Lastgines, Jonathan V. Lastricanes, you will no longer stand between me and my destiny.
Mike00:00:16But I will. I told you it was always between us.
Guest00:00:19Oh, I hate to smash you out of existence. To drive your cursed face from my memory forever. Enough talk! Yes, let this be our final battle.
Mike00:00:42Welcome to the Sub-Beacon Podcast. I'm your co-host, Mike Warren. Joining me, as always, are my two co-hosts. By the power of the Sub-Beacon, they have the power. Jonathan V. Last and Sonny Bunch. Join us over at Sub-Beacon.com. Tell your friends and family if they want to listen to the show, they've got to do it at Sub-Beacon.com. New episodes every Friday at Sub-Beacon.com. We are going to be talking about the Masters of the Universe 1987 edition later on in the show. But first, JVL, what is going on?
JVL00:01:16Boys, I'm having all the feelings. Flash graduates from high school tomorrow. Oh, my goodness. He's a man. He's I just. Dusty. Yeah, everywhere, everywhere I go, it's dusty. And you know what this means. There's only one way for me to cope with my feelings. Some people eat their feelings.
Sonny00:01:42Wait, wait, hold on. Hold on. Did you did you buy a pinball machine or a watch?
JVL00:01:50Yes. When you say that, because the answer is I'm trying to decide which one I'm going to buy in the next two weeks in order to make the hole in my heart get filled that there's a hole in my heart. And I got to I got to stuff that in like, you know, like when sometimes with insulation, the spray foam insulation for me, the way my my cardiac system is set up, I can I can mend that by injecting either a watch or a pinball machine to it. So.
Mike00:02:19Well, yes. Yeah. Things will fill that hole.
JVL00:02:24So that's all I got. How are you boys? All I can say is treasure this. Time you have with your children now because it goes by so fast.
Sonny00:02:34You know, it goes by so fast.
JVL00:02:36It doesn't actually go by so fast.
Mike00:02:38Hey, hey, Jonathan, are the days long, but the year short?
JVL00:02:43You know, man, days are long, but the years are short.
Mike00:02:49All right. Well, congratulations to Flash on what we assume this will this will go off. You know, there's always like that, you know, the I you know, there's no moment in the graduation like there is in a wedding, which actually never happens in a wedding where like, you know, speak now or forever. Hold your peace.
JVL00:03:06If you think any of these kids don't deserve to graduate, speak now. He's a bum.
Mike00:03:11He's an idiot. That kid's no good. But I do think like graduation is like it definitely like a fait accompli. Like he's at the point now where it's going to happen.
Sonny00:03:19So they don't you know, I will say exactly one lesson.
JVL00:03:23The graduation properly understood is not for the kids. Oh, no, the parents. Yeah. How hard is it to graduate from high school? I know. Not hard these days. How hard is it to keep a kid alive for 18 years and fed and gotten to school on time and learning how to read all that stuff? That's hard. That's super hard. So really, certainly the graduation ought to be people ought to be congratulating the parents. And that's what I do. When I see parents who are graduating, I tell I don't say congratulations. They say, hey, congratulations.
Mike00:03:57This is you. Good job. You did good work.
JVL00:03:59You made a good job. Well, I just I just said this.
Mike00:04:02I just said this to a colleague who's who's one of their kids graduated and joined the military and got married, like all on the same weekend. And it was like congratulations on like fulfilling the obligations and getting to the finish line with one of your three children. Like that about us. Yes. 100%.
JVL00:04:21It should be about us. We're not celebrating the we're celebrating us. Indeed. Indeed.
Mike00:04:27Uh, Sonny, Sonny, Sonny, what do you celebrate?
Sonny00:04:32I, uh, I am celebrating something actually. As a matter of fact, I the other day I was I was using my kitchen sink. I don't know what kind of kitchen sinks you guys have, but the kitchen sink I moved in, it's one of the ones that has like a little hose that pulls out and you press a button and it's got a little spray nozzle. Yeah, I feel like these are pretty standard at this point in a perfect design kitchen kitchen, you know, never has any problems. But, uh, so I, I, you know, we've had this now for six years, who knows how long it's been in there, but the, the button that like makes it turn on the sprayer part has been sticking. Like it's, it's been a little bit, you know, and it'll, it'll stick in and then like, it won't come out or, you know, what's that calcium buildup? Probably almost certainly some sort of. Anyway, but I, uh, the other day I was using it and I pressed the button in and the guts inside of it just shot out into the sink, like the, the whole middle part of it exploded. Like the part that like turns it into the high powered jet.
Mike00:05:32Like the aerator.
Sonny00:05:34Is this, I don't, uh, I, I, I could look at it. I, if you give me a second, I'll look it up after I finish here.
Mike00:05:39Delta.
Sonny00:05:41No, no, no, no, no. It's, uh, I'll, I'll look it up after we, is it a Moen? No, it's not a Moen. It's not a Moen.
JVL00:05:50They're fucking great.
Sonny00:05:51It's none of these. Is it a price? Fister, my Moen price, Fister, Fister. Like Fisto from, uh, like Fisto, I don't even know her. Uh, no, I, all right, hold on. Since this is gonna, since this is gonna derail everything, I will look it up right now. I will look it up, uh, right now. Cause I ordered the same.
JVL00:06:08Well, he looks that up, Michael. Do you agree with me that the acceptable brands for plumbing are Kohler and Moen?
Mike00:06:17I, I've had some issues with my Moen, uh, kitchen, you know, kitchen faucet. Um, it's, it's like, I've had to replace, uh, things in it that I feel, uh, the, like the little, um, canister thing that goes in to, uh, uh, that, that where it essentially, uh, turns, you know, where you turn the, the faucet up and down, it's, it's had some loses, but I, in general, I'm fine with Moen and, um, yeah, Kohler is, is very high quality. I agree.
Sonny00:06:44Um, it's a, it's a Kraus. I don't know what that is. It's a Kraus. I don't know. So I just, I just bought another, I bought, I bought another, uh, I'll get, I'll get to this in a second. Hold on. You're derailing, you're derailing my whole thing here. I got, so I, uh, I have, uh, I have, uh, I, in, in my head, my first thought is, oh shit. My second thought is, oh shit, this is probably gonna cost me like $500 cause I got to buy a new faucet and somebody's got to come and install it. I'm not installing that myself. That's not a thing. That's not a thing I'm going to do. Uh, just on general principle. Sure. But I'm like, I was like, I took a, I took, I took the hose part out and I was like, oh, maybe I can actually just fix this. Maybe I can like get the thing to go back in. And I did, I was able to like actually get the thing to go back in and I turned it on and it worked fine for a couple of times and then it shot out again. So I was like, ah, crap, this is, this is broken. So I was like kind of looking at it and I was turning it around. And again, I'm thinking like, God damn it, this is going to be, I'm looking up the, I'm looking up the faucet itself and you know, it's a $200.
JVL00:07:45Looking for the warranty.
Sonny00:07:46What's that?
JVL00:07:47Looking for the warranty. Cause I tell you a Moen or a Kohler would have a lifetime warranty on that bitch.
Sonny00:07:53So anyway, uh, again, I, I like kind of fix it. And it, it shoots out again. So again, I'm thinking, I'm like running through the cost. Cause it's going to be a couple hundred bucks for a new faucet. Uh, it's going to be, you know, 200 bucks to get it installed, whatever. It's going to be a day of having to deal with a plumber in my house, whatever. I mean, I'm like, take it out again. I'm kind of futzing around with it. And I realized as I'm doing this, that it actually unscrews this like little top part. Uh, the, like the, like, I don't, whatever you call it, the faucet head, the like sprayer head screws, which I had no idea. I just didn't realize that I did not realize that you could just unscrew it and it turns out you can just unscrew it and buy a new one and screw it in. And it works perfectly fine. And so what in my head was a $400 to maybe 500, who knows job is suddenly now a $25 job. I've just saved myself 400 some dollars. Probably I'm rich.
JVL00:08:43I'm rich money in your pocket, which is not, was it Churchill who said there's no exhilaration, like having been shot at and missed.
Sonny00:08:50It's exactly, it's exactly what this, I was so, I was like happy. I was actually happy that it broke because I fixed it for cheap and I was like, this is great. And now the new one works, the new one works better. Kind of. It's like a little, it's a little weaker. The stream that comes out when it turns into a jet is a little weaker. I might, I might actually do a proper job of shopping for sink heads in the future here. Now that I know it's just a 25 to $30 upgrade. Cause I, if I can, if I can save, you know, if I can save so much money, I, I can, I'm still saving money. Even if I buy two of them and have an extra one, it's.
JVL00:09:25My, my plumber friends tell me that, uh, the restrictors that are in them, which once upon a time were removable are no longer removable because of the government, the government with their black helicopters won't pull your retreat. See, but you know what you can do can drill holes in them, get a very, very small, uh, drill bit, and you can go in and add some extra holes, which will get that water pressure back up from your, that's what I need to do.
Mike00:09:52I need to get, it's like it going to a chop shop. So they take them up.
Sonny00:09:55I need to get Fisto on this. Maybe Fisto can fist a hole in it. Anyway.
Guest00:10:01Oh boy.
Sonny00:10:03Fisto, of course, is a character from, uh, from Masters of the Universe, but not the new, not the old Masters of the Universe.
Mike00:10:11Yeah. I don't remember a Fisto in the, in the 1971. Only the new one. Only the new one. All right. Well, we'll get there. Um, so here's, so I was, I was talking about, uh, this a little bit before we started recording about how it's, I'm, we're in the thick of it with baseball. The post season for little league and those things. It's very exciting, but the, the, with all the excitement, the most exciting news happened, uh, on Sunday night, uh, the, uh, kids are in bed, not asleep, but in bed. And so like the house is quieted down and, and we are just trying to sort of like, okay, get ready for the week and all these things we got, uh, playoff games and all this stuff. And, uh, I see a. So it's about 9:30 and I see a pair of headlights kind of pull up to our house and a man get out and pull out like, uh, some kind of, some kind of package, um, and start walking to our house. I'm thinking, I'm thinking, oh, like this is kind of where this is going. This is kind of late for, for a delivery, right? Like 9:30 on a Sunday night, a little late for a delivery, not a delivery of death. Uh, no, uh, and he opens the box and there's a shotgun in it. It was a violent case actually. Um, and, uh. And so I, I'm like kind of, we live on a cul-de-sac and like, we have become those people where like any unfamiliar vehicle that pulls into the cul-de-sac, it's like, you look, you're like Gladys Kravitz on a bewitched. You're like looking through the, the blinds and like, what's, what's going on out there? Who is that? What, what are they doing? So I'm watching this person walk to my house up, up to my house, uh, with what looks like a package and it turns out it's not a package. Um, it is one of those, uh, you know, yard signs. Uh, you know, just like a square with the, with the metal things. Uh, and this, this man puts the yard sign in my yard, like, like you might, like, you know, a, a contractor might put in or, or, you know, a graduate
Sonny00:12:09roofs, roofs by Joe, right?
Mike00:12:11Did you shoot him? No, I did not because it turned out that the sign Texas red, no, the sign red, the person never came to the door or anything like that, just put it in there and then got in the car and left. He said, uh, a, uh, a little league all-star lives here. And it was the way that we found out that my oldest is an all-star, which, uh, was great. And then like all these things like kind of clicked into place that I didn't think about. Like we had gotten an email earlier, uh, in the previous week that was like, um, it was like, please resubmit this, uh, for potential tournament play, uh, some, you know, uh, some medical form. And I was like, that's, that's weird, but whatever I did, you know, it was like, I wasn't thinking about what it, what it was necessarily saying, but I thought the idea of it was fantastic to just like put it in the yard. And, uh, it's like you got into the fraternity a little bit. Yeah. But it was, it was very nice. And we've, he's never had that, had that opportunity before.
JVL00:13:15And so, um, you know, of course he's played congratulations to you, Michael, not to him. Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate that. You're the one who got him onto that all-star team. Through all of your hard work and parenting over many, many years. So you deserve the congratulations for this. This is your achievement. Thank you.
Mike00:13:33Well, I have to say, I think I was more excited about it than he was. Um, so the next morning he like woke up and I was like, Hey, why don't you, uh, why don't you look outside, uh, see, see what's out there. And he was like, look, and he goes, Oh, I'm an all-star. Cool. And then it's like, went to go eat breakfast.
JVL00:13:51You know what? Acting like he's been there before.
Mike00:13:53I know. I know. Too cool for school. But, uh, anyway, so it was great. It was very exciting. And, you know, we've been playing in this league now for, uh, uh, gosh, now it's, it's now been five years, um, that he's, that he's played in this league and his younger brother is in it. And then their youngest brother will also be in it. According to him, he really wants to play. So you learn, you, you get to know a lot of people, you play with a lot of different coaches and, you know, we know a lot of kids who are this South County.
JVL00:14:18Is it West Springfield? What's the, what's the league you wind up in?
Mike00:14:22Well, no. So we are, uh, we are in. We are in Annandale, North Springfield, little league. Um, uh, and so there are different divisions of the, of the all-stars and tournament teams. So as you know, JVL, so there's, there are the little league, right, right, right. So there, there, there are different levels, but then there's also kind of a, a, a difference. So there are the little league tournament teams and there are the district tournament teams. The little league tournament tournament teams are those that go on to. Uh, potentially to like the little league world series, like if it's on that track.
JVL00:14:59Right.
Mike00:15:00Uh, and then the district is, it goes to, it's basically like a one-off tournament for the district. That's the one that he's on. Um, he's on the, but he's on the majors district team, um, which is like the 12 U. Um, and so most of the kids are, are like, this is their last year in, in, at the majors level and playing, you know, there's, there's, there's little league after majors. But it's different. Um, they played a different field and they, whatever. Um, and so he's, you know, so he gets to do that and basically he's, he's going to spend like the next, like the, like two and a half weeks of his summer vacation, like practicing every day and then go, well, you know, there's a tournament with other little leagues in the area. Um, so yeah, so it's, it's exciting. It's something he's never done before. Something, you know, like, you know, what I was saying is there were a lot of parents and families for whom, like, this is just. A normal part of their summer, you know, they're all, they're always on all-stars and I got a bunch of brothers who were doing it and they've all got the gear that, you know, and so, uh, it's never something that we've ever done or he's ever expressed interest in. Um, and so it was very exciting and, you know, it's a cool thing because it's part of it's determined by, uh, the players, the players vote on who they think should be an all-star, but then it's also influenced by the coach. And so, um, I, I told his, his, his coach this year on his majors team, um, you know, uh, and, and, and, and, and he did as well. Thank, thank the coach. And I just, you know, it was really exciting and thrilling, uh, to find that out and said, you know, he earned it. And so it was very, uh, it was, it was a nice, it was a nice moment. And so it was very exciting.
JVL00:16:43No, he didn't.
Mike00:16:44I earned it. You owned it. All of that, all of that dragging the field at the end of the game that that's earned that indeed. For him. Don't ever let them take that away from you. Of course, this is something that I never would have done when I was a kid. I was, uh, I had no skill level when it came to baseball or any sport for them. So, um, so it's, it's very exciting. That's what's going on.
JVL00:17:10Shall we, uh, move on? Let's let's get, we got a lot of hot. He man on man.
Mike00:17:15We, we do, but we, we do have to briefly talk about the box office because number one at the box office this week is backroom. The, which we discussed would probably be the number one, uh, last week, uh, followed by number two obsession and, and star Wars, the Mandalorian and Grogu, uh, really just eating shit at the box office. Um, uh, in the number three spot, uh, any quick thoughts before, uh, box office thoughts before we, uh, move on?
Sonny00:17:42Uh, well, I mean, I, I think I said last week that backrooms was going to vastly outperform the NRG tracking, which I think had a 45 million, something like that. I, I think I said it would be 75 to 80 million. Um, there was, there was a moment in the weekend where it looked like it could do 90 million
JVL00:17:58and then the, the, it was a little more front loaded than that.
Sonny00:18:01Um, which is, I mean, that's, that's a huge number. And look, the question, the big question is what does it look like second weekend? Because it's, it's going to be front loaded because horror is always kind of front loaded. Correct. Um, and it's, and it, and it is an IP thing, right? Like, so like there's some talk like, Oh, look at this original. It's not original. It's, you know, there, there's a big fandom for this out there.
JVL00:18:21It's copypasta, not copypasta. What's a creepy pasta?
Sonny00:18:23Creepy pasta, right? It's like a 4chan thing. Yeah. It's like a YouTube thing too, right? Kane Parsons like started, riffed on the 4chan thing and made it a YouTube series. And like, there's, there's a fandom there. There, there is an, there's an existing fandom, but it is not this size. This is, this was a very big number. This was something that clearly broke out, um, beyond the, the basic fandom. Cause you saw, I mean, look, you saw this with the, with Markiplier's Iron Lung back in January, right? Which like that opened at 17 million, something like that. Which is about 2 million off of the new Sam Raimi movie, Send Help. So like that, that, uh, you know, there, there is an audience there, but this obviously vastly, uh, blew, blew past that built-in audience and, and did something really interesting. And so the question is, the question is, um, what are we, uh, what are we looking at in terms of how it's going to hold? Uh, and there are a couple of comps you could make here. One is. Five Nights at Freddy's. So remember Five Nights at Freddy's, which again is another kind of like Gen Z video internet based video game phenomenon that also opened to $80 million. That also opened to $80 million, but it's total domestic gross was $130 million. So like, you don't really see multiples like that very often, you know, from an $80 million opening. That's a 1.6, 1, uh, 1.7. I don't know. You don't see multiples like that very often. It's bad. Multiple. Uh, this movie is holding better on Monday and Tuesday than Five Nights at Freddy's held. Um, it helps. I think that the audience is a little bit older. You can, and it helps that again, this has like legit stars or at least legit actors that older people know. This is the thing about this movie is that it actually works perfectly well. If you have no knowledge whatsoever about the, the YouTube series, which I didn't like, I had no, I didn't know anything about it. I just went in totally cold. And it works perfectly fine as a standalone thing. Um, so, uh, so it's fine. Um, but we'll, we'll see how it holds. Uh, the, the other big story here, of course, is obsession obsession, which again grew from its second weekend to its third weekend. It is up 14%. Uh, JBL, you okay there?
JVL00:20:44I don't know what's going on. My camera's like connecting and deconnected. Just you keep talking. I'm going to try to figure it out.
Sonny00:20:49All right. Um, uh, the obsession. Again, grew this weekend, 14%, uh, you know, looking, if you have to go back into the archives and the best comp people can find for something like this happened, where a wide release movie grew both in its second weekend off its first weekend and its third weekend off its second weekend is ET. Now ET, you know, you adjust ET for inflation. That movie grossed something like $800 million domestic. It's, it's an absurd number. Uh, maybe it like may even be a billion dollars. I don't know. It's, this is not going to do that. Um, but. You know, it's, it's a movie that opened to 13 million or something like that and is probably going to end up doing 200 million domestic. It's, it's, it continues to have near sellout audiences on Tuesday and Wednesday night. It's Tuesday this week was better, bigger than it's Tuesday last week, which was bigger than the Tuesday of the week before that, you know, it's Wednesday this week was bigger than, uh, well actually I don't know about Wednesday yet. Um, but the, but the Tuesday was definitely bigger. Uh, so like obsession continuing to do huge numbers, backrooms continuing to do huge numbers. And as you said, Mike star Wars, the Mandalorian and Grogu fell off cliff 70% drop worst ever for a star Wars property like that, that movie is going to, that movie is going to limp to one 60 probably, you know, uh, which is, uh, or maybe one 70, I don't know, but it's, it's not, it's not gonna, we'll see. I mean, it may lose, it may lose all its screens this weekend. I like, meanwhile, you still have, you have Michael out there, which is still holding on pretty strong. It's, I think this is its biggest drop this weekend and it's still only approximately still only a 40% drop. It's still doing, still made almost $12 million this weekend. Um, it's at 340 million domestic, it's at 850 million worldwide. It's probably going to get to a billion dollars, uh, once Japan kicks in. Um, you know, it's, it's the, the, the, the numbers here are crazy on Michael. So I like, it's been, it's been a, it's been a good several weeks at the box office. Uh, we are, I believe up, we're certainly up over last year, I don't know, like 10 or 12%, something like that, but we're, but the big thing is we're up over the biggest post pandemic year by five to 10%, kind of depending on which day you look at the numbers. Um, so that's, uh, that's, and this is going to be another big weekend. This, this weekend, you've got the masters of the universe movie isn't going to do that well. It's going to do 30 to 40 million. Um, but scary movie, whatever it is, scary movie five or six, that's going to come out and that's going to do $60 million. Um, I think it's tracking it 45 or something like that. It's going to over-perform. I think, um, there's a lot of, there's a lot of pent up millennial nostalgia for the scary movie franchise, which has gone away for a long time and it's kind of, I'm sorry, you're,
JVL00:23:31you're telling me that masters of the universe is going to do $40 million.
Sonny00:23:36I do not think it will get to $40 million. I think it will be closer to $33 million telling me it's going to be more than 15.
?00:23:43Wow.
Sonny00:23:44I would say it's going to do, it's going to do more than 15. It's going to do more than 50. It's a, I mean, look, it's a big movie. It's a big, big movie. There is a, there is some, there is some, uh, you know, fan base there, but it's going
Mike00:23:56to, have you seen it? Have you seen it, Sonny?
Sonny00:23:58I have seen it. I didn't care for it.
JVL00:24:00I didn't like it. Finest movie review. I haven't read it ever.
Sonny00:24:03Thank you, JBL. Thank you. Thank you.
JVL00:24:06I, uh, the, uh, that's a competitive category.
Sonny00:24:09The, the, the pro like the movie makes the problem with the movie, we're not reviewing the new masters of the universe, I'll just say the problem with the movie is that it is embarrassed to be masters of the universe. It, it, it's not just that it's kind of campy and tongue in cheek. It's that it's campy and tongue in chink and constantly saying to the audience, look, we get it. This is dumb. Ha ha ha. Look at how dumb this is. And like, that is actually what annoys me much more than just being campy or whatever. Like remember that dungeons and dragons movie that came out a couple of years back with Chris Pine. Um, yeah, it was, it was fun. It was fun. But it was, and it was an entertaining movie. It was an entertaining movie because it wasn't embarrassed to be a dungeons and dragons movie. It was just a straightforward dungeons and dragons movie. It was, it was fun. Um, and it was like, yes, it was kind of silly, but it never said to the audience, Hey, can you believe how dumb this is? Look at all these dumb things. These are, these are just characters being played by a kid on a table somewhere like in stranger things. It's so dumb. And like, that's what, that's what this movie does. It's like embarrassed by itself, which I find, I find offensive, frankly, as just as a viewer of movies. Like if you're gonna, if you're gonna spend $200 million on this sort of shit, own it. Don't, don't do it half-assedly and apologetically.
Mike00:25:27Just do it. Well, I, I have to say, uh, that is very unlike what the 1987 masters of the universe, uh, filmmakers may know that this is, this is definitely not a movie that they are embarrassed about. This is a movie. They, uh, they went whole hog on. Should we, should we, should we move in and talk about, about, about this movie? which I saw for the first time ever. Sonny, why don't you give us a review of the 1987 Masters of the Universe?
Sonny00:25:58Masters of the Universe, starring Dolph Lundgren and Frank Langella as He-Man and Skeletor, respectively, is...
JVL00:26:06And Courtney Cox.
Sonny00:26:07And Courtney Cox. Well, we'll get into this in a minute, but it has a stacked cast. Well, I'll, so to speak, I'll address this in a moment. But the, but so Masters of the Universe is, it's a fascinating film because as you're watching it, you realize what has happened is that Menachem Golan and his partner in crime, what's his name? Globus. I forget what his first name is. I just love Menachem. Menachem Golan, love that name.
JVL00:26:39Irish fellow.
Sonny00:26:40Irish fellow, yes, very Irish. They, from the Dells and the Locks. Anyway. The, Golan and Globus, what they have done is they have taken, they have taken Superman and Star Wars and Conan the Barbarian and the name Masters of the Universe. And they threw it in, they threw all those things in a blender and then on the blender, they hit the cheap button. They were like, make this for no money. And, and that's, that's not fair because this was actually a tremendously expensive movie for Golan and Globus, which was renowned for making, you know, five to $10 million movies. This is a very cheap movie, but it, for them, it was very expensive. But the, but like you just, just watching, just watch the first like 20 minutes of this thing where the score comes in and it's this like actionable knockoff of the Superman theme. Like I, like straight up, you know, and even the, even the title card has like kind of the, the rainbow color, color effects, like the Superman flag. I like, if I had been Warner Brothers watching this, I would have been pretty upset, frankly, by what I was seeing or whoever made the original Superman. The, so, so you've got that. And then they go to this, they go to this planet where like, it's very like Skeletor's design, like his throne and him. He's very clearly modeled on the emperor, right? Like he's the emperor from Return of the Jedi and he's got his floating, you know, chair and there's, there's laser guns and they're all shooting and like, okay, you got the Star Wars.
JVL00:28:20The helmets on the minions are Darth Vader's helmet minus the faceplate.
Sonny00:28:26Yes. Basic, yes. I mean, that is, that is. They're black stormtroopers. They're black stormtroopers. They may have just bought those off a shelf and spray painted them and, you know, distressed them a little bit and put them on people. And then, and then again, you've got Conan. You've got Dolph Lundgren basically like, is like, okay, I'm going to do the Arnold Schwarzenegger thing and be a kind of loincloth, sword-wielding strongman. And, and the problem was they made this movie for very cheap, which as a result means you can't set it on Eternia because if you set it on Eternia, you got to build sets. You got to build sets and you got to, you got to like have, you got to build vehicles and you got to, you got to do special effects. But if, and here's where the cheat button comes in. Here's the magic trick of the cheat button. You take a movie like this and you put it on earth. You bring, you bring the, you bring your heroes to earth and then you can just use empty warehouses and you can use suburban homes. Burger joints.
Mike00:29:31City streets.
Sonny00:29:31You can use city streets and you can use cars that you can just get out of a parking lot. And so that's what they did. And as a result, this movie is like actually kind of, I would not describe this movie as good through the first 17 minutes, but it's, it's at least kind of interesting through the first 17 minutes because it's like, well, we're on this place and they're doing things and hey, it's Dolph Lundgren. I like Dolph Lundgren. And, and then they go to earth and it is the most boring shit I've ever seen for like 40 minutes. Like all the stuff with Courtney Cox and Lieutenant Tom Paris. I don't know if any of you were Voyager watchers. Did you watch Voyager? The Star Trek, Star Trek Voyager? No, no, no Star Trek. But I'm watching this. I'm like, who is this? Oh yeah, that's right. It's Lieutenant Tom Paris from seven seasons of Star Trek Voyager. That's where I know him from.
Mike00:30:20That's the boyfriend.
Sonny00:30:21That's the boyfriend. And it's got the, it's got the principal from Back to the Future who was also the, the, the crusty, you know, Admiral from Top Gun or whatever, whatever rank he was.
JVL00:30:32Skeletor is Frank Langella.
Sonny00:30:35Skeletor is Frank Langella who's great. He's like, who is not, he's not super recognizable, but he is, you know, he's, he's like, he is Frank Langella. He's like, he has gravitas even in a terrible plastic, skull mask that you can like see the fabric where his nose is to make, to create, to create the appearance that he has a nasal cavity there. And you've got Billy Barty as, as Gwildor, as Gwildor, the key, the key guy. So it's, anyway, the cast is, again, the cast is actually weirdly good. And I haven't even mentioned yet, Meg Foster, who is of course the woman with the terribly scary weird eyes from They Live That's like she had, she had a hell of a, I think They Live actually came out in 88, but she had a hell of a run there from 1987 to 1988. Evil Lynn and weird woman from They Live. Good, good couple of years for her. I like it.
Mike00:31:31You didn't mention the woman who plays the sorceress is Christina Pickles, who is, plays the mother of Courtney Cox's character on Friends later on. In the 90s. I did not even, you did not even know that?
Sonny00:31:49No, I had no idea.
Mike00:31:51I clocked that from the opening credits. I was like, Christina Pickles? Who's that? She plays the mom in Friends. That's amazing.
Sonny00:31:58Don't, I did not realize that, but good for her. Good for her. Anyway, wait, is she, wait, is she Courtney Cox's? Is she Monica's mom?
Mike00:32:06Yeah, she's Monica and Ross's mom and married to, married to Elliot Gould. Yeah.
Sonny00:32:13Oh, good for them. Good for, good for her. Anyway, so we get to Earth and the movie is terrible and boring at least until the ragtag group of mercenary guys show up and then it's still terrible and boring, but at least there's some stuff happening in it. I don't know. This is a movie I probably saw a dozen times as a kid. Maybe more. Maybe, maybe. I saw this movie, I probably watched this movie 20 times as a child and I always thought it was, this is perfectly, this is fun. This is a good, fun movie. I'm excited for, this is, look, it's He-Man. He's doing things. And I don't think I ever really, I think I always knew it wasn't good, but it was entertaining enough. I didn't realize that it makes no sense, that nothing in it, nothing that happens in this movie makes even the tiniest lick of sense. The stakes don't make any sense at all. At one point, like the whole thing about He-Man is that he's like, he's like this cowardly prince, but then he pulls the sword and he turns into He-Man and he's like, wait, he's just He-Man the whole time. So it's not even really, the same character. And when he...
JVL00:33:17Well, we'll talk about canon in a little bit.
Sonny00:33:20Okay, we can talk about the canon of He-Man in a minute. But when he goes and he gets his sword back, which apparently, I don't, there's something about powers and the universe and whatever. He gets his sword back and he turns into like Superman. He's out there. He's just Superman with a sword. He's just wrecking shit. He's killing guys and knocking them all over the place. And by this time, Skeletor has turned into like a gold, an Incan Mayan emperor with a giant gold headdress. And I was like, this reminds me a lot of that G.I. Joe movie, that animated G.I. Joe movie that came out. He's like, who is that guy?
JVL00:34:00Serpentor?
Sonny00:34:01Yeah, Serpentor. He was Serpentor for a minute. He goes full Serpentor. No, so this is not a... Oh, and also, at the very last minute, I would love to have been in this script meeting. At the very last minute of this. So, like, the setup for Courtney Cox's character is that her mom and dad have died in an airplane crash not long before the film was started. She's going to move to New York away from Lieutenant Tom Paris and start a new life, you know, 3,000 miles away. And she just needs a fresh start. She just needs a fresh start. And these assholes show up and start blowing up her city and they're trying to find this key. And the thing of the key is it can send you to any place in the... You press... You do the right synthesizer chords because it runs on music because the universe is music.
JVL00:34:50It's one of those Japanese synthesizers.
Sonny00:34:52It's one of those Japanese synthesizers. That's actually a funny... That's a funny gag. That cracked me up. That cracked me up every time they did it. Just a little... Just a little xenophobia. I like it. But the... And also, like, very much in tune with the, like, yellow peril movies of the moment. It's like... It's like, so... It's like, where'd they get that from? Nakatomi Plaza? Anyway. The... So... The... So this thing can send you anywhere in the universe. I'm like, okay, fine. I accept this. It's a key to anywhere in the universe. That makes perfect sense to me. With, like, five minutes left in the movie, they're like, also, it can send you to any time. And I was like, what? What? What? I feel like this is useful knowledge. We could have used this to... You have the thing now. Just go back in time and kill baby Skeletor. Like, I don't understand what we're doing here. What's happening? But instead, she uses it to go back in time, like, five days so her parents... her parents survive the airplane crash or, I don't know, a month or whatever. And everybody has a nice, happy ending. The end. Again, not a good movie in hindsight. I don't know what eight-year-old me was thinking when he watched this a hundred times as a child. But it's... I will say that I still like it more than the new one because it's not embarrassed to be a Masters of the Universe movie. It's authentically bad. And I appreciate that. Lean into it. That's what I... That's all I'm asking for.
JVL00:36:23JVL, your thoughts. So it reminded me a lot of Flash Gordon. Except that... It reminded me of Flash Gordon in the sense that the people who made Flash Gordon and the people who made Masters of the Universe are both authentically trying to make a good movie. Yes. And just failing. Mm-hmm. The difference is that in Flash Gordon, Brian Blessed, knows it's a bad movie. And so he is just like going gonzo and he's fun. And in this, like it's a little... But I don't think this rises to the level of camp. Like it almost hits that bar. Agreed. But it's never bad in interesting enough ways to make it campy. It's just bad in bad ways. Yeah. And so I don't think it bears much re-watching. We could talk more about just He-Man in general as a piece of intellectual property in a minute. But Michael, had you seen this before?
Mike00:37:19No, this was my first time watching this movie.
JVL00:37:21Did you love it? Did you have exposure to He-Man as a property growing up in any format? The comic books, the action figures, the TV series?
Mike00:37:30No, the only experience I had with He-Man besides sort of like hearing about it on that VH1 show, I Love the 80s, which is probably where I first heard about it, was the early, early internet memes involving He-Man and Skeletor, which which survived to this day, which sort of use, you know, He-Man in the animated series. You know, elements of that, you know, Skeletor like laughing and putting his arms up like, you know, in Triumph. There were people would would sort of dub audio into it. So the answer to that is basically no. I really don't know anything. Is this He-Man? Is related to She-Ra, correct?
JVL00:38:17That's that's She-Ra is the spinoff.
Mike00:38:19Okay. Okay. I mean, it's the same thing. And if you had told me that Thundercats was also involved with this, I would believe you, even though I know it's not.
JVL00:38:27But it's like it's Thundercats is post He-Man, I believe, and comes from it. It is a copy version, right?
Mike00:38:35And it fits in with all that with with the Transformers, right? It's like it's like toy attic, you know, find, you know, it's a toy. And this is the vehicle to sell the toy to kids. Um, right. Because my my He-Man was the Ninja Turtles, the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. That was sort of what I my entry into that that part because of my age. So the movie itself, um, I, I actually enjoyed it in spite of everything that you guys said, which was correct about it. Like I was I was sort of like, you know what? It's it it kind of just as it as it is and like for what it is. It's fine and works and and it's kind of fun. And I could see eight year old me absolutely eating it up. And I and I actually think it works in a like the things that don't work about it also work in a weird way for for an eight year old like watching this, which is there is a mystery about the planet that they're on because you don't see enough of it. And the and so when you don't spend any time
Sonny00:39:45on Eternia, really, you go to Castle Grayskull for like five minutes at the beginning and five minutes at the end. And well, they spend a lot of time in Gwildor's little hut.
Mike00:39:53Correct. Correct. But but the and you know, there's that scene in the beginning where Skeletor like astral projects himself to the entire planet and and like and sort of announces whatever he's doing from from Castle Grayskull. And so it very cheaply there's like four silhouettes of people who are like standing on a hill listening to him and you're like, Oh, that's I guess he's talking
Sonny00:40:19to the celebration at the end of the last starfighter with like 12 guys going. Yeah, exactly.
Mike00:40:25And so but but the intrigue of like, well, what's going on here? And like Castle Grayskull is kind of like there's a lot going on in there and that's kind of interesting. And so it would it would have been very appealing to me to think about, you know, this world. And then the idea of putting it in on our earth, like I do believe that a lot of ways like restrictions on art can be creatively fruitful, right? If you know and and and there's some, you know, with not always, not always. And I think with like better with better with a better bigger budget like this could have been this could have been like a huge, a huge thing like it does kind of feel like that like they have something here and they just don't have enough money and maybe enough like experience with me, right? This is a this is a studio that made like Chuck Norris movies, right? So like like it just feels like, oh, it's in better hands. This could have been better. But as we may discuss, like maybe the IP just doesn't just doesn't suggest it. But well,
JVL00:41:39can I tell you guys a story, please? Because I would like to explain He-Man to go ahead, go ahead. He-Man exists for two reasons. Star Wars and Ronald Reagan. Let me tell you a story, kids. In 1978, Star Wars is released. And so we said Lucas 77 George Lucas Lucasfilm goes shopping around to sell the toy rights to it. He goes to Mattel, the number one toy maker in the world. The people behind Barbie. Yep. And Mattel said says, No, thank you. And so instead, an upstart toy maker, the Avis to Mattel's Hertz Kenner purchases the rights and then takes over the entire fucking toy industry because the only thing that anybody buys for the next ten years. Right. Are Star Wars toys. Mattel is freaked the fuck out. They are being pushed totally out of the boy toy aisles at Toys R Us and Kitty City. And they have to figure out a way to get back into that half of the store. And so they have an initiative where they're trying desperately to launch new action figure lines. Now, simultaneously, the Reagan FCC changes a longstanding regulation which forbids kids animated television shows from being based on toys.
Mike00:43:08Hmm.
JVL00:43:09And so what storm, if you. What Mattel decides to do is they are mucking, mocking up products and samples of action figures to figure out what would be commercially viable. And they come up with this character, He-Man. The idea is to create a figure who is not tied to any time and place because they think this is part of Star Wars is appeal. It's not like a G.I. Joe figure that is like, you know, now or is set in the 1950s and like that. And when something is just universal and that they can sell worldwide isn't really tied to to land country or that or. And so they they do three mockups of He-Man, one with him as a soldier, one with him as a space dude, and one with him as a barbarian. And they decide to go with the barbarian version, which is not at all homoerotic. Don't say it is. So they they do this, they get the toys on the shelves, and then they go out and contract with a company called Filmation to do an animated series for them. Filmation does two series. Two sixty five episode seasons, because since we're working in film or in animation, right, you can just truck through the stuff. This shit is so cheaply made that the character Orko, who is created only for the TV show, is originally supposed to be named Grillo, I believe, or Gardel, whatever, whatever the fucking thing in the movie is. Okay, Gwyndal Gwyndal. The reason they change that is because when they has a G on him, they reuse a lot of the animation cells by simply flipping them over. So when Orko was going right this way, they don't have to reanimate. If his symbol is an O, they don't have to reanimate to watch him go left.
Sonny00:45:01That's by the way, the reason could have been an M.
JVL00:45:04The reason Orko is not in the movie is for the precise other thing. They couldn't figure out how to how to cheaply convey in live action a figure that floats and has no legs. That's why we wind up with Grillo in the Orko role. Otherwise window, it would have been Orko. So this this animated series is made for two years, but they have 135 episodes or 130 episodes of the thing. And kids go crazy for it. Briefly, it becomes a craze.
Sonny00:45:31I love I will say this is right. I was right in the demo here. I had He-Man figures. I watched the He-Man cartoon. That's what I did.
JVL00:45:39Well, one of the things the animators did because the story pitch given to them by the brains at Mattel was so idiotic. They basically threw out all the shit that was written by them and was like, we're going to make our own story for this. And so they came up with, among other things, the idea that he has an alter ego. Why does he have an alter ego? Why does is there a Prince Adam? Because they knew that what little kids love is to see transformations because they see themselves in the transformation. Ah, ah. They'll see Prince Adam isn't special, but he can become He-Man. And this is what he. So this becomes the defining feature of the show that he man has this magic. Prince Adam, I'm sorry, has this magic sword that when he raises it and chance the incantation by the power of grace called blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He can become somebody better and bigger than himself and can use the sword. I don't know if you remember this, but to transform his animated friends who are normal into their own versions of the superpower. Oh, this is a key aspect of the the animated series, which then gets reverse engineered back into the toy line as Mattel realizes. Oh, shit, we can sell Prince Adam toys. It's the same sculpted head like we can. Okay, great. We'll sell people both a He-Man toy and a Prince Adam toy. Go nuts, kids. Ask your parents. And all of this sort of gets in and it becomes a craze and it fizzles out pretty fast. He-Man.
?00:47:15He-Man.
JVL00:47:15He-Man. He-Man does not actually have the staying power of a Transformers or a G.I. Joe, because ultimately people realize this shit is stupid. Why is this barbarian and his friends? Why do they have tanks, but also they ride around on battle cats? Why are they in a castle made of stone, but they also have laser cannons? This makes no sense.
Mike00:47:40None of these were all my questions as I was watching. I was like, why does he have a sword? But every. Everybody has laser guns.
JVL00:47:47It's magic and it's barbarian night stuff. Yeah. And it's and it's science fiction in none of it makes any sense. And this is why of the big three toy properties of the time, Transformers, G.I. Joe and He-Man. He-Man has always been the redheaded stepchild. The thing which people have tried to make work over and over and over again through She-Ra, through various comic book adaptations, through various attempts of putting it in theaters. There was an animated theatrical version of this before the 1987 live action and now the new one. And again, none of this happens without Star Wars and Ronald Reagan.
Mike00:48:26Amazing. Amazing. Drop. Boom. Uh, yeah, I, the whole, the whole, the whole universe, as it were like it, you're right. It makes no sense. And it's, it's almost kind of hard to understand why they thought it would make, like, it just seems so pieced together. And derivative of Sonny, as you've pointed out, like it's derivative of all these other things.
Sonny00:48:50And, and I think, no, but I mean, I can, you can see the thought process here again. It's like, Hey, we've got, you know, you know, what everybody loves is Superman. That movie made $200 million. You know what? Everybody loves Star Wars. Everybody loves Star Wars. People love Conan, the barbarian. Let's just make it. Let's do all those things.
JVL00:49:09That Arnold Schwarzenegger is really hot right now.
Sonny00:49:12Yeah. I like, I, I get it kind of, but it, it obviously. Is idiotic hindsight being 2020, but it does also seem like the He-Man thing was over by
Mike00:49:23the time this movie came out, right? Like if I'm looking at the timeline correctly, right? He-Man stuff, definitely on the tail end of it. Right.
JVL00:49:30So, um, yeah, it's at the end. I believe the He-Man craze is winding down basically by 1986 and this, and then out the door button a year later.
Sonny00:49:40And then it's, uh, what takes over is like Ghostbusters and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Those were.
Mike00:49:45Yeah, that's the app and bigger than He-Man ever was, you know, as three movies, live action movies, you know, of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and the early nineties will test, um, a couple of other thoughts. So could we talk real quickly about Courtney Cox and this was, this is, so I did look up her age cause she's supposed to be playing like a teenager and she does not look like a teenager. And it's not just because the. Ladies haircut and, and other styles, like, you know, made, made people look older, but she's like, she was like 23 when this movie was made.
JVL00:50:22So, um, she looks plenty like a teenager.
Mike00:50:24All right. I don't know. Boy, uh, it puts the lotion in the basket.
Sonny00:50:29What's the better, what's the better early friends movie, this or leprechaun leprechaun.
Mike00:50:35I know I thought about leprechaun, especially I, I was wondering, does, was Billy Barty
Sonny00:50:38the leprechaun, but he wasn't, uh, no, no, he's war it was Warwick Davis. That's right. That's Warwick Davis.
Mike00:50:44Um, yeah.
Sonny00:50:45I, I would say leprechaun's better leprechaun's better, um, better movie anyway.
Mike00:50:51Uh, any other thoughts on masters of the universe or leprechaun true, truer to what it is, is
Sonny00:50:58the thing like that's what makes it a leprechaun is not necessarily a good movie, but at least it understands what it is.
Mike00:51:04My preferred leprechaun was, um, leprechaun, I believe it was leprechaun six back to the hood, back to the hood, not the first one in the hood, but the second one, um, the first
Sonny00:51:15time you went to the hood, you were offended. You were like, this is a gimmick. I was like, do not belong in the hood, but Hey, but you know what?
Mike00:51:22The second one that I was like, they found more stories, they found more stories to tell.
Sonny00:51:25They really nailed it this time around. They went in the first, he goes to space and he's like, well, space doesn't work out. I gotta go back to the hood.
Mike00:51:32That's right. The moment where he says, uh, the moment where the leprechaun says that he loves to smoke a pipe and then takes, uh, takes, uh, a bong hit or a pipe hit or something from one of
Sonny00:51:45the guys, a crack pipe or a marijuana, it's marijuana and, uh, and that's a whole different
Mike00:51:51movie. Totally. But, but that, that moment, uh, was, uh, we, we, we repeated that those lines several times in high school after watching, oh, Jack city.
?00:52:02Okay.
Mike00:52:03Uh, any other thoughts though?
Sonny00:52:06Not none. Uh, um, we should do a leprechaun, we should watch all the leprechaun, seven weeks of leprechauns. Jamie L trying to figure out how to end this thing, the whole, uh, no, I have no more thoughts on this, this movie. I was, I'll just say that we watched it on or at least I watched it on canopy. Were you able to get canopy?
Mike00:52:28It was, no, I, I couldn't, my, my library doesn't have, doesn't allow for canopy, but I watched it on, uh, on prime, which is on Amazon prime and no, I didn't have to rent it. It was, oh, it was free on prime. Free with ads.
Sonny00:52:41Yeah.
Mike00:52:42Oh, with ads.
Sonny00:52:43Oh, with ads.
Mike00:52:44I mean, yeah. That's why you're telling me to watch ads. I mean, it was, it was like, uh, I'll admit I was, I was checking my, I don't want ads
Sonny00:52:52in my, my movie that was created to sell children's toys. Thank you.
JVL00:52:57You have Prince. I'm not going to watch ads inside my ad. I got watching a Coke commercial and then they interrupt it for an American express commercial. And then they go back to the Coke commercial.
Sonny00:53:06It's like, it's like when I, it's like when I'm trying to watch a, I put in a DVD and I get, uh, I get, I get trailers for other movies. Fuck you. If I wanted to watch those movies. I want to buy those DVDs. I don't want that. I just want to watch this movie.
Mike00:53:19Here's a sad, a sad commentary on like the recursive element of all this is like, I admit I will go on YouTube to look up old ads that I remember from when I was watching TV growing up. And then we'll see a current ad playing on YouTube before the ad for you don't pay for
JVL00:53:37YouTube premium. No.
Mike00:53:39Why would I do that?
JVL00:53:40I don't pay because your job requires you to watch a lot of shit on YouTube and otherwise you're sitting watching ads. Skip ad, skip ad.
Sonny00:53:48I don't watch. I don't, I don't watch. I don't watch a lot of YouTube. Yeah. I actually don't watch a lot of YouTube either. I, when I, I watched, I watched when I watch videos for the bulwark, I watch it on the bulwark website because I got it. That's well, there you go.
Mike00:53:59But uh, for me it's, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, one of these just, you know, like uh, or a boros of, of ads where I'm just, you know, watching old ads, seeing new ads so that I could watch more of the old ads that sold me things when I was seven.
Sonny00:54:13That's the worst thing I've ever heard. That's the, that's the horrifying God and this, we need to end this episode before we admit to something like what you do to hobos sick, something sick, real, truly sick.
Mike00:54:25All right. Uh, well that is all the time we're going to give to this episode. Join us over at some beacon.com. Uh, tell us your favorite, uh, character on masters of the universe and we will talk to
Sonny00:54:36you next time. Mike's like, I couldn't, I couldn't get off watching those old. KFC ads anymore. So I went down to the, the pound and I got a sack of kittens, tossed them in the river.
Mike00:54:52I was like, Oh, just so I could feel just so I could feel something.
Sonny00:54:58Colonel wasn't doing it for me anymore.
Mike00:55:00Yeah, I'm sure it's fine.
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