#303. Thunderbolts* (Theaters)
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The main event is Thunderbolts, and the three hosts land in three different places: Sonny gives it a straightforward thumbs up, calling it a fun, well-built standalone "hangout movie" with a genuine emotional arc, and praising Florence Pugh's Yelena, Wyatt Russell's underrated John Walker, and Lewis Pullman's Sentry/Void villain design; JVL is much colder, arguing the film only looks decent against a five-year run of genuinely bad Marvel movies (he rattles off the list from Black Widow through Captain America: Brave New World) and singling out Sebastian Stan as a non-presence on screen and Julia Louis-Dreyfus's Valentina as an incoherent mashup of Selina Meyer and Nick Fury; Mike breaks from both of them to say Louis-Dreyfus was actually his favorite part, and floats the theory that the movie's real theme isn't therapy but community and purpose pulling people back from the void. Before any of that, the trio runs through their usual long opening stretch of banter — a breaking-news Pope-smoke joke, a surprisingly deep AirPods Pro consumer-reports segment (JVL is fully sold, Mike's cheap knockoffs keep yelling "volume maximum" at him, Sonny recounts never once losing a pair), Sonny's son staging elaborate Star Wars Unlimited card-game battles around the house, and Mike's family movie night rewatching 1960's Swiss Family Robinson, which spirals into a shared bit about the primal appeal of treehouses. They also work through the week's box office, with Thunderbolts opening soft at $74 million while Sinners keeps defying expectations past $180 million domestic; Sonny walks through Warner Bros.' recent run of hits and bombs, and all three agree the MCU brand is "on life support" heading into Fantastic Four and Avengers: Doomsday. The episode closes with chatter about the Fantastic Four post-credits stinger, Robert Downey Jr.'s upcoming turn as Doctor Doom, mild fatigue with Pedro Pascal, and a runner about spotting "David Brooks" as a fake newspaper byline in the credits, which spins into Sonny pitching a full David Brooks MCU-commentary show.
From the show notes
It's a Marvel movie! But not the bad kind, like you don't want.
Full transcript
Mike00:00:00Welcome to the sub beacon podcast. I'm your co host Mike Warren joining me as always are my two co hosts who just before we hit record, we're saying cucumber, cucumber, cucumber over and over again. Jonathan V. Last and Sonny Bunch join us over at sub beacon.com. Tell your friends and family if they want to listen to this show. They have to become patrons and they have to become patrons by going to sub beacon.com. Join the conversation. New episodes every Friday morning, sub beacon.com. We're going to be talking about Thunderbolts later on in the show. But first, what is going on JVL? You've got a little something for us, don't you?
JVL00:01:03White smoke, white smoke, white smoke. We have a Pope. I'll be just just just came across my my feed while we were sitting here as you were doing your intro. I don't know. All we know is
Sonny00:01:17white smoke. It's gonna be white smoke is new Pope black smoke. Black smoke is no Pope. Is that
JVL00:01:24right? Yeah. Do I have that? No. Black smoke means that they've elected an anti Pope. New Pope. Black smoke means that Satan has taken has ascended to Peter's throne. The white smoke means somebody read Dan Brown. Here I just have a very quick very quick bit of consumer reports for you boys. Because I don't know about you. I had long wonder. First of all, I didn't get AirPods till very, very late. I thought they looked silly and that you would lose them all the time. I got my first pair of AirPods like three years ago, and I really liked them. I thought they were they were actually quite good. And of course, I did lose them because this is what you do with these things. And so I replaced them with a second set of AirPods that were the new versions of them. I think the AirPods for I did not like the AirPods for as much they were the sound was better. But the fit and the comfort was I did not care for. Those have disappeared. Although this I blame my children. I'm reasonably sure one of my kids took them. So I anyway, I just I ordered a set of AirPods pros. Just out of curiosity, because this is one of those purchases where me at least always wonder, is it really worth the extra the extra 60 bucks? I think because I think it's a $60 premium you're paying for. And I just have to say 100% it is. They are much more than $60 better. You know, it is there's a bunch of things with them. But the the comfort level is night and day. They stay in your ears better. They feel better while you're in your ears. The sound is probably like two x or three x is good. And then the active noise canceling is really quite nice. So if you are ever one of those people who is trying like trying to figure out, oh, is that upgrade worth it? Because many times the upgrade is not worth it. You're better off just getting the normal version. But in this case, AirPod Pro, AirPod Pro is worth worth the extra 60 bucks. I would not pay $150 more, but at the level of like,
Sonny00:03:35you know, $100 versus $159, get the AirPod Pros. I often wonder this myself because I am not a headphone snob, but I am somebody who likes to have both like good and functional headphones. Like I went through three different sets of noise canceling headphones before I found the ones that like work. Properly and and, you know, we're comfortable, whatever. And so but I use I use the I currently have in my ears right now, the AirPod, the third generation AirPods. Third, they're not it's it's not it's not the noise canceling one. It's not the air, the AirPod Pro. But I I became I became I was also kind of late to the AirPod game. I think I got my I'm looking at my Amazon purchase history right now. I got my first pair in twenty twenty one. It was like the first the first generation. Like I got them really cheap because they were on clearance or whatever because they were getting rid of those and bringing in the new ones. I was like, I'll take a flyer on these. And they were great. I loved them. I loved them. And I love these ones, too. The third generation, because they have the the spatial this, you know, the like you turn your head and it's like the sound moves with you thing, this whatever whatever Apple calls that the spatial dynamics or whatever. It's pretty cool. It and it like the first time I put them in, I remember I was at the gym and I was wearing them for the first time, like, you know, in the in public in the gym. And I I I hit play on like the show I was watching. And I immediately hit pause because I was like, oh, shit, my my AirPods aren't on. They're not because I was it was like I was hearing it six inches in front of me. And like when I and then I realized it was no, it's actually connected. It actually works really well. But you think going even one step higher from the from the third generation to the pros from to the to the third generation, is it the third generation pro or the second
JVL00:05:31generation? It's the second generation pro. The current lineup is a fourth generation normal and a second generation pro. OK. And going from fourth gen normal to second generation pro is again, it's just a huge upgrade in terms of comfort and sound quality. And like for me, fit like they just fit better. They don't feel like they're going to fall out. And anyway, I just I don't want to belabor it. I just want to just, you know, anybody out there who is like trying to think like, oh, am I going to buy a pair of AirPods? Is it worth because you never you never know with these premium versions of shit. You never know. In this case, it's totally no,
Mike00:06:11I totally agree because I can be the opposite side of that endorsement because I when my AirPods went on the fritz a couple of years ago or maybe a year and a half ago, I bought a super cheap non Apple version that that I am currently wearing, actually. And like all they do is frustrate me with like tiny little problems. You know, like if if I if I touch it in the incorrect way, then all of a sudden it's like it thinks that I'm like trying to raise the volume and it will just keep like raising the volume. And then it has this little British voice in my ear going volume, maximum volume, maximum volume, max, like over and over again. Drives me nuts.
JVL00:06:57But is it like a hot British voice like Vanessa Kirby?
Mike00:07:01It is Vanessa Kirby talking you off in your in your it is a little more matronly that I would prefer. That's all I have to say about this opportunity. Exactly. Sonny, what's going on with you?
Sonny00:07:15Uh, not much. Not much. Well, I have one more. I do have one more question. So JBL, you lost you lost your first and second set of headphones.
JVL00:07:25The first set went through the wash. Yeah. The second set disappeared.
Sonny00:07:31Like the whole thing disappeared?
JVL00:07:33The whole case disappeared, which is why I think one of the kids.
Sonny00:07:37You can't track it?
JVL00:07:39This is the thing. It shows up on the find my it says it's it says like, you know, here last located in my house, but then it won't connect to it.
Sonny00:07:49So it's somewhere in your well, so it's somewhere in your house, but it's in the case still.
JVL00:07:55Probably somewhere in the house, but the battery's dead. You know, I'm sure we'll turn it up when we move in 15 years.
Sonny00:08:01Yeah, it'll shake out of a cushion or something. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. Sorry, I I'm always fascinated by the lost air air pod discussion because I've never I think we may have discussed this before, but I've like I have never lost. I've had them now for four years, almost these two pairs, and I've never lost one. And like the only time I came close to losing one was when I was coming out of I was coming out of the target and I like took something off over my head and did not realize that I had them in and they both popped out and I get back to my car and I'm like, oh, fuck, where's my where am I? I like went to pull them out of my ears and I was like, oh, they're not here. Oh, because I just pulled this thing over my head and I went back and they were luckily they were right there. Some guy had like picked them up already. I was like, thank you. Those are mine. But it was but but I like I hear these stories about people who are just like constantly replacing them. I'm like, how do you live? How do you how are you people? How do you do this?
Mike00:08:59I live with somebody like that. That's a question I ask about a lot of people for a lot of situations. How do you get through life?
JVL00:09:05I cohabitate with somebody like that.
Sonny00:09:07OK, OK, well, I won't I won't push it then. Anyway, what's going on with me? Yes, what's going on? You know, so we watched Skeleton Crew. We watched the family watched Skeleton Crew, which is the Star Wars kids show. It's like. It's like Star Wars Goonies, basically, is is the the the best shorthand for it. And my kids loved it. They they they very they were very into it. They were like they would repeat it. And like part of this is just trying to delay going to bed. But they would repeatedly come to us at like seven fifty at night and be like, can we watch Skeleton Crew episode? It's like, no, you can't. You can't do that. If you wanted to watch that, we should have watched that 30 minutes ago. And they they would get upset and we would. But but we got we got through it. Finally, they liked. They liked it. They liked it a lot. And I like my son is getting very into Star Wars, which is kind of interesting, but he's getting into it in slightly. Odd way, did I? I told you guys about the watching The Empire Strikes Back with him. I don't think you did. Did I not know? So, OK, so this is not weird. This is totally normal. So we so my wife and daughter had a thing to go to last Friday. They were they were they were out. So my son and I had some had some time. I was like, what do you want to do? What do you want to do? And he was like, I want to watch. I want to I want to get pizza and I want to watch Empire Strikes Back. And I was like, sold. We can we can do that. That's a thing we can do. And that was a nice that was a nice little night. You know, just just eating some pizza, watching some Empire Strikes Back. It was very, very boys night. But he is he is very he is very into this. Star Wars card game, the Star Wars Unlimited game, but not so much playing the card game. He likes to play Star Wars, right? Like with, you know, blasters and running around and flying ships or whatever. But he likes to do it like he's playing the game JBL. So, like, he will say things like, I've taken the initiative and I'm and I'm going to use my general veers to attack you. And I'm just like, OK, I. Who are you attacking? Who are you attacking? He's like, I'm attacking your Echo Base Defender. All right. Fair enough.
JVL00:11:31Oh, why do you have Echo Base Defender in your deck? That's a lame card.
Sonny00:11:37Echo Base Defender is great because he's Sentinel. I love Sentinels. I like having Sentinels up there to absorb damage from the base. As long as you can't attack the base, things are golden.
JVL00:11:45Who's your leader? What leader do you use?
Sonny00:11:48What depends on the deck depends on the deck. But I'm just I'm still just using Luke Skywalker mostly.
JVL00:11:54Who should I upgrade to? Luke blows.
Sonny00:11:58He can put shields on people. He put shields on all the people. It's great.
JVL00:12:02I mean, I Vader is an excellent leader. Boba Fett has been banned from from serious competitions. But you're not doing serious competitions because he's too powerful. He's overpowered. Jango Fett is going to be banned.
Sonny00:12:19These are both. These are all dark side characters. Who is the light side character?
JVL00:12:23Sabine, Sabine Wren, I think, is a light side character. She's not bad. Do the dark sides are better. The dark sides are better. Do you like dark side versus dark side? Sure.
Sonny00:12:38Can you do that? Is that allowed? Is that legal?
JVL00:12:41Yeah. Any deck is legal.
Sonny00:12:44I will say. Fascinating stuff.
JVL00:12:46All right, we'll stop. We'll stop.
Sonny00:12:47Oh, I'm sorry. Can we get 17 minutes of Little League Baseball? Talk next? Because that would be that would be great. I'm done. I go ahead, Mike. Oh, what's going on with sports?
JVL00:12:59As a matter of fact, that is what we're going to get.
Sonny00:13:02Could you tell us about it?
JVL00:13:03No, no, no, no, no. He got some pop. You said you were going to talk about it, Michael. No, I said I was not going to talk about it. I said, oh, I'm sorry. I I misunderstood. I thought you were telling me, give me a preview and that you were going to talk. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Mike00:13:16The only thing I the only thing I will say, but I want to move on to something I did want to talk about was that because of rain outs, my ten year all triple a team has this week three games, including two weeknight games. Oh, next week, five games, including four weeknight games.
JVL00:13:39So are you four weeknight? That's like the actual major leagues. Yeah, totally. It's exactly what I thought.
Mike00:13:48I was like, oh, man, we have a couple of days of rest here, some travel days. For to get out to the West Coast.
Sonny00:13:56Our so it's the same way. We had a bunch of rain outs and now we have like four. We have four games in a row, like four days of games in a row. It's really annoying.
Mike00:14:05It's it's it's wild. No, but what I actually want to talk about was similar, Sonny, in terms of what I'm watching with my kids. So we have been my wife and I have sort of we're trying to get the kids into watching stuff that they normally wouldn't pick. But that we think that they would have they would enjoy and sort of broaden their horizons outside of, you know, Ninjago and bad Netflix kids sitcoms. And so the other night it was my turn to pick movie night and I was thinking like, what can I really shake them out of their out of their comfort zone? But something I think they will enjoy. And I took a risk. I took a risk, but I said, let's you know what we're watching on Disney plus Swiss Family Robinson. Are you guys Swiss Family Robinson fans from 1960?
Sonny00:15:06Like the one where they live in a tree? Yes.
Mike00:15:10And because I had memories of watching that movie multiple times on on VHS and like being being like deeply fascinated with it and my wife had never seen it. So now we this was like I was like showing the whole family this movie. And as I predicted, the boys loved it. They absolutely loved it. And you know what hooked them? That was the same thing that hooked me, which was the treehouse treehouse treehouse. The treehouse is like it's it's even as a as an adult rewatching it after having not seen it for 30 years. Like I was like, Oh, this treehouse is amazing. It's so bad ass. And it is a it is a pure fantasy of what every like little boy wants a treehouse to be like. And like like they were so did not want to watch it. We're so how we have to watch this old movie. You know, like this movie was so old that like your grandparents were little when it came out and then they were just hooked after that. And it was great. It was awesome. It was great. And we actually ended up having to watch it over two nights because we started it too late. And it's actually kind of a long movie, but it's a delight. It's wonderful. And I highly recommend Swiss Family Robinson for your your next movie night if you have kids.
Sonny00:16:39So I will I will say I think I have mentioned this before. I'm pretty sure I have. But when we at Disney World and Disneyland both, they have a Swiss Family Robinson treehouse like they have the treehouse. And you can you walk up it and you go in the various rooms and you look at things and you know, it's fine. And it's fine. But my son loves that, like just would go up and down and up and down. And there's no line. It's not like there's a it's not really a ride. It's just like you walk through it. It's not even really it's not like, you know, they have like play areas where you kids are climbing on ropes. It's not even like that. It's literally you just like walk up this tree and you walk down this tree. And I, I must have. I must have walked up and down the two versions of this tree something like 30 times over the last several years. What on my various trips to.
Mike00:17:32What is it in the parks? Maybe your visits to the parks to like see it in sort of person can you can you could explain it. But like there is just there's something so it's like unobtainable in the real world. But it feels like if we just had like a little more ingenuity, like we just kind of knew what we were doing a little more as kids, like we could build a treehouse. I feel like it's like it as it's on that line of like feasibility, but just out of reach that makes it so enticing for a kid.
JVL00:18:08Also, it's got like the the Gilligan's Island ish. It's it's just like a normal house with all the functions in a normal house.
Mike00:18:15That doors and pulleys brought the piano or the organ running water.
JVL00:18:21Yeah.
Mike00:18:22Yeah, I think I think that I think that's it. It's anyway. So that's that's all I got.
Sonny00:18:27I mean, it's it's it's a cool like it's the idea of living in a tree. Everybody wants to live in a tree, man. We've been wanting to live in. That's why we build skyscrapers. We have a we have a we have an evolution driven urge to get off the ground and into the sky to get away from the predators who are hunting us and to get up in the air to get. And that is what the tree is, right? The tree is like. You've got creatures on the ground that want to eat you. You want to go up, but also it's kind of cool up there. It's just like you can see a long way. And there's there's, you know, there's emus up there.
JVL00:19:03Pee off the tree deck.
Sonny00:19:05Pee off tree decks. That's right. I never had a tree house growing up. Did you guys have tree houses? Was that was that.
Mike00:19:12We had forts in the woods, but not in the tree.
JVL00:19:17My buddy, Ed Condon, who is a friend of the show, who is right now in Rome, hustling up this new pope story. He and his brothers went through a tree house building phase in college. So it's serious tree houses. And he he is threatening to come up this summer. And he me and Flash spend a weekend putting up a real deal tree house in our our place. I kind of hope it happens. It. Looks. Yeah, there's whole the whole thing was revolutionized because of this bolt that was invented. And yeah, yes, we discussed this one. The bank robber. We talked about the bank robber.
Sonny00:20:04No, I like tree houses are cool, man. People, everybody wants a tree house. Yeah. In the righteous.
JVL00:20:09I just want to roof the tree house. I mean, you just want to. I just want to do the shingling and the roofing on the shingle. That's what I care about most. I only build the tree house that I can get to the to do the roofing.
Sonny00:20:20You're you're now just like. Like building these in your yard so you can put paper on it. Yeah, that's like what that's what. Yeah.
?00:20:28All right.
Mike00:20:30OK, well, should we should we move on then and discuss box office? Because the number one movie at the box office this week is the movie we're talking about this week on the show. Thunderbolts bringing in just over $74 million in its opening weekend. Number one at the box office, followed closely by Sinners. Which is now in three weeks of the box office, bump down to number two. It has it is just under $180 million so far. Really kind of a juggernaut here. Any box office thoughts, gentlemen?
JVL00:21:08I I've got one. Yeah. Yes. The Marvel Cinematic Universe is dead.
Sonny00:21:18I think that's I think it's I think it is much it is on life support, certainly it is, you know.
JVL00:21:25I mean, this is a terrible. This opening is about what Eternals did. Yes, this is below the Black Widow opening. This is way below Ant Man and the Wasp Quantum Mania.
Sonny00:21:45Yeah, but that was a you know, I don't know. I am. I'm kind of interested to see how it holds, because I think word of mouth will be OK on it. But I also think these things are super front loaded now. Like, I think you have you have a.
JVL00:22:00Quantumania opens to $106 million, and that was a terrible, terrible movie.
Sonny00:22:04What's that?
JVL00:22:05Quantumania opens to $106 million, and that was a terrible, terrible movie. If if this is the best you can get with a reasonably engaging ish Marvel movie, certainly the best Marvel movie in probably like four years. It just means that the foundations of this thing have been dynamited. That's my contention.
Mike00:22:29But this is this is like the the thing we always talk about, right? Which is the the sequel after the bad sequel suffers, the suffers for what came before it. Right. Like like Mission Impossible three suffers because Mission Impossible two was so bad before it.
JVL00:22:47Right. This is coming on the heels of Captain America. Brave New World was just out like what? Four. Five weeks ago. Which is bad, which was just bad. And I mean, what are what are what are the roles in Guardians three? I mean, this is so many bad movies. Back to back to back to back to back.
Sonny00:23:03You didn't like Guardians of the Galaxy Volume three, but it was very well reviewed. Audiences loved it and it made a ton of money. So like that, that but but it is it's on the heels of Captain America. Brave New World. Deadpool and Wolverine is not really isn't really an MCU movie, right? Not really an MCU movie, right? The Marvels and Ant-Man and the Wasp Quantumania. So, you know, Ant-Man three Guardians three Marvels to Captain America, whatever. I that's like a whole new series, I guess, because it's a whole new Captain America. Three of those movies are just terrible. I mean, Captain America, Brave New World, the Marvels and Ant-Man and the Wasp Quantumania are all very, very bad. So I'm not I'm not shocked. I'm not I'm frankly not shocked. This movie this movie did poorly.
JVL00:23:48I'm not shocked either. But but the. The fact that we're not shocked is what I'm I guess I'm just trying to say, I think the. I think there's nothing left holding it up anymore.
Sonny00:24:00No, I mean, look, I think these are the this is I think we're basically back to the initial run of Marvel movies where absent something, you know, kind of lightning in a bottle like the first Iron Man movie, right? These movies do about 400 to 500 million worldwide. The first Captain America did. I think a little under around 400, you know, the first Thor movie does about that. I think they basically have to rebuild from here, which which, you know, I think they're very panicked about this, which is why they brought Robert Downey Jr. back to be Doom in Avengers Doomsday. I assume I assume the Fantastic Four movie is going to bomb or at least not bomb. I assume it's going to do about about this number, about 70 to 80 million opening with a pretty steep drop. Off and top out at around 350 to 450 million worldwide. Question. I think question. Yeah.
Mike00:24:57Fantastic Four is an MCU movie.
Sonny00:25:00Yes. So fantastic. So Fantastic Four First Steps is the way that they are bringing the Fantastic Four and also possibly the X-Men into the the Marvel Cinematic Universe. That's that's what's going on here. The end of that movie is going to bring bleed into Avengers Doomsday is my understanding.
Mike00:25:23OK. And OK, that would I'll hold the rest of my questions. Thank you. Thank you, sir.
Sonny00:25:31Do you have I mean, you have more questions.
Mike00:25:33Do you want to know? I just I well, yeah. And there are things that I have other questions about that may be answered, maybe not be answerable about like the future of the MCU. But bottom line is, don't we think that maybe we could talk about this when we talk about the movie itself, but don't we think that like this if if if it is on life support, like you couldn't you could do a lot worse than this movie to try to rebuild the MCU?
Sonny00:26:02Yeah. Well, all right. Well, we'll get to that in one second. I do. I do just want to highlight Sinners real quick, which continues to do enormous business. I mean, it's at one hundred eighty seven million right now. Domestic, which is, I believe, what's that for X? The it's almost four X the. The the opening weekend, you know, I again, I like I said this on the show. I think it could do Oppenheimer numbers. I don't think I again, I don't think it's going to get quite there, but it's dropping the drops on this movie are crazy. It dropped four point eight percent after the first weekend. It dropped twenty seven percent after the third week or for the third weekend. You know, if it drops and let's say drops thirty three percent this weekend, let's say drops a third. It's still going to be doing twenty two million dollar, you know, fourth weekend, which is a which is a big number. So much. I mean, it's it's this movie. This movie is going to make this movie is going to make at least somewhere between two hundred fifty and three hundred million dollars domestic. And it'll probably pick up another hundred million worldwide or one hundred million international for four hundred to four hundred fifty worldwide. Let's say that's a crazy number. That's a crazy number for an R rated original movie like that is a number that does not happen for this. Sort of movie. And again, you see it. You see it very occasionally. Oppenheimer did did bigger business, but it had bigger international stars. It was always going to make more money overseas than this was that got to nearly a billion dollars worldwide. This will not do this will not do that sort of money, particularly internationally. Again, I don't know if you guys know this. The rest of the world is pretty racist. America, not racist. The rest of the world, very racist. They don't like black movies. So, you know, I I it's. It's great. It's great that this movie is doing so well just for pure business of box office, like get studios to take risks sort of reasons. I am. I cannot. I cannot emphasize enough how how good this is for the idea of film as an industry. I hope it I hope it spurs a lot of copycat efforts and we'll see what happens.
Mike00:28:15I have a question about sinners. Did. In terms of expectations that Warner Brothers had for this movie, maybe we've talked about this before, but like where is this is this exceeding their expect beyond their wildest expectations? Is this like at the upper bound of what they thought could happen or I guess the lower bound of what they thought was possible past what they thought was possible? Like what? Where does this fit in? And I mean, they have to be pleased no matter what. I'm just curious what they thought this.
Sonny00:28:50Would do so. Well, I mean, I don't I'm not in the studio offices of Burbank. I can't tell you precisely what they thought, but the a lot of the conversation preceding this movie, this movie was the heads of Warner Brothers are on the way out. They have made a lot of big they've made a lot of they've they've done a lot of big, risky things. They've got this Mickey 17 movie that cost one hundred and eighty million dollars or whatever with Robert Pattinson and it has bombed. They've got this Minecraft movie coming out. Who wants a Minecraft movie? That's that's going to do terribly. And then they've they spent an absurd amount. They spent one hundred million dollars on this Ryan Coogler movie. Don't you know those movies don't play overseas? And then in short order, you had them you had the critics basically being proven right by Mickey 17, which is an enormous disaster. That movie is a mess. It's not good. But then they were very wrong about Minecraft. Minecraft is a movie that comes in and makes Warner Brothers. You know, that movie is going to get up to around a billion dollars worldwide. That movie is an enormous hit. It's a huge, enormous franchise hit. It's a movie that they can make more of. And then you have Sinners, which was which was one of one of the first movies that was really signed off on by this by this creative team. The guys who are in charge right now, whose names escape me and who everyone was saying that that David Zaslav is out there trying to replace them, trying to get rid of these two. And this movie comes out and I think there was there again, there was a lot of there was a lot of chatter in the in the the the the trade press about how this movie was going to have trouble making its money back. And people in people, people online were like, oh, look at Variety being racist. And the issue wasn't that Variety was being racist. They were trying to further the narrative of this. This film team is going to be out at Warner Brothers and David Zaslav is going to bring somebody else in. And instead, what has happened is I think I think Sinners has performed better than anybody could have expected. I don't I don't think that that is crazy to say. And I think it hasn't. I think it is vastly outperformed. It's not just that it's at the upper bounds. It's like people assume that this would probably do one hundred hundred fifty million domestic and then kind of die overseas. And, you know, then you get a big. But like I, I will. Again, I will say, having having seen this movie twice now with a paying audience one time and a preview, audience that was like 30 percent critics and 70 percent, you know, regular audience members. Having watched this movie with an audience twice, if you watch this movie with an audience and did not understand how well it would do, you deserve to be fired as a film executive like this is this is a movie that fucking kills with audiences, particularly black audiences and like not understanding that is malpractice. So did that answer your question, Mike?
Mike00:31:49Yes, it did. Thank you very much. Shall we move on to talk about Thunderbolts? Yeah. Thunderbolts. All right. You want to give us. Yeah, there we go.
Sonny00:32:00Thunderbolts, directed by Jake Schreier, starring. I don't actually know how to pronounce Jake. Jake Schreier, he's an indie director, whatever. It was one of these guys ever again starring Florence Pugh, Sebastian Stan, Wyatt Russell and a whole bunch of other people. As as a team of misfit heroes who have have to come together and overcome their anxiety. That's right. This is a movie about psychiatry. This is this is a you go to this movie because it's a you're you're fighting your manic depression and you're fighting your your feelings of imposter syndrome. And you want to you want to feel good about yourself. You come to you come to Thunderbolts, baby. That's what we're here for the movies. No. So the setup here is. Ah, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, his character, who is the head of the CIA and some sort of, you know, shady arms manufacturing company, pulls together Florence Pugh's Yelena. Wyatt Russell's John Walker, who was Captain America for two minutes. Taskmaster played by Olga Kuralenko, who's in this movie for approximately 30 seconds. And Ghost Hannah, Hannah John Kamen, they she gets them all together in a room so she can kill them. They don't die. And they find a guy. His name is Bob, played by Lewis Pullman. And Bob is basically Superman. But like more than Superman, he's got like psychic. He's like Neo. He's basically Neo. Bob is basically Neo. And she, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, wants to make Bob the Superman figure of the Marvel Universe to protect from foreign intergalactic invaders. And she wants to kill the Thunderbolts. Which is this team that also Bucky Barnes is part of now. And so is the Red Guardian, Alexey Shostakov. Yada, yada, yada. There's so much set up here that it kind of obscures the fact that I actually like this movie kind of a lot. Because it is a stand-alone movie with its own beats that works all by itself. Its own emotional arcs. It's got a visual. Idea behind it. There's this kind of constant recurring idea of shadows and darkness to represent the void. Which is where Sentry sends people. He sends people into the void. It makes them all want to kill themselves. Because again, he's Captain Manic Depression. And at the end of the movie, we find out that it's actually the New Avengers. That's what the asterisk in the title is for. It's the New Avengers. Anyway, I like this movie fine. I enjoyed hanging out with all these people. It's a fun hangout movie. I like all these characters. I like being with them. I like John Walker a lot. This movie, the MCU has done John Walker dirty. They try to paint him as a villain and a bad dude. He's just a normal guy. He's just a normal guy. He's very charming. He's got problems. Yeah.
Mike00:35:04Is John Walker in the comics? Is he a character in the comics?
Sonny00:35:08Yeah, John Walker is a character in the comics. Is he the U.S. agent? Is that what his deal is, JVL?
JVL00:35:13U.S. agent is his character's name.
Sonny00:35:15So he was like a replacement to Captain America. Captain America in the 1980s, I think, and he was like darker Captain America. And Captain America had to come back and rest the mantle of Guy Gardner. Captain America. Yeah, more, more or less. Anyway, long story short, yes, he's in the comics, but he's introduced in the MCU in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier show where, again, like Captain America is gone. They need a new Captain America. They ask Sam Wilson, the Falcon, to be Captain America. And he says, no, I can't be the Captain America. I'm black. And so they pick this like corn fed American white boy and he's and he's Captain America. Long story short, he executes a terrorist who is trying to surrender on a livestream with the Captain America shield, just fucking bashes his head right in. And while he did nothing wrong, he loses his job for doing this. It's really a travesty. John Walker is one of the great heroes in the Marvel Cinematic Universe. He doesn't get the respect he deserves. And then Sam Wilson becomes Captain America. Anyway, that's all that. I don't know, man. I enjoyed this. I like I think Florence Pugh is charming. I think Wyatt Russell is charming. I think Lewis Pullman does a very good job as, you know, kind of the again, Manic Captain Manic Depression Century. He's called then he becomes the void. I like the villain design of this movie. I like I like the like just kind of like black, the black dark space with the pinprick eyes. I don't know. Good movie. I enjoyed it. Thumbs up. Thumbs up for me. JVL JBL looks like you have to have a stroke counterpoint.
JVL00:36:53I mean, this is what we've come to. You've been so radicalized by all of these terrible fucking move. I'm just going to pull up the okay. Captain America Brave New World Deadpool Wolverine the Marvels Ant-Man and Wasp Quantumania Black Panther Wakanda Forever Thor Love and Thunder Doctor Strange. Multiverse of Madness Eternals Shang-Chi and The Legend of the Ten Rings Black Widow. All of these movies are bad. They're all bad going back to 2019. The only good Marvel movies are Spider-Man No Way Home. That that's it and it's not really a Marvel movie. It's a Spider-Man movie that's that's the good Marvel movie. Going back to 2019. We've gone half a decade with Marvel movies being really really bad and the fact that this isn't the Eternals is what makes you think. Yeah, I guess it's pretty good for a Marvel movie. This is where we all went to with Star Wars, right? We had so many terrible Star Wars movies that people started going. Yeah. Well, that's not bad for a Star Wars movie, right? Once you start adding that claws. It means that everybody's over the thing and I understand parts of what you're saying Sonny. Florence Pugh is absolutely charming and winning in this movie to the extent that you get David Harbor. He is. He is actually not written exceptionally well in this movie. Like, you know, the is he's a great screen presence, but he's really written as a one-note kind of guy.
Sonny00:38:45Yes comic relief.
JVL00:38:47He's comic relief. I mean not in a man like you get enough comic relief from him very early in the movie because he doesn't change speeds. The John Walker character is great. The Bob character is is fine enough. But the whole thing just feels like a mash-up of I'm sorry. Sebastian Stan is not a leading man. Stop trying to make Sebastian Stan happen.
Sonny00:39:12Well, I think he is very pointedly not a leading man in this like he gets introduced late in. The movie or later like this is Florence Pugh's movie.
JVL00:39:21Yes, but Sebastian Stan is a absolute zero on the screen. Yeah, like there's just nothing nothing there. But here's it. It feels like a mash-up of other things. And so, you know, like when we finally get to the third act, it is Nightmare on Elm Street meets Inception. And the whole thing feels like yeah, it's like Suicide Squad with a little bit of Guardians of the Galaxy thrown in right everything feels like pastiche. And for me the biggest problem and the problem that really lay at the heart of it was Julia Louis-Dreyfus. Yeah, who I think has been horribly miscast in the Marvel Universe. She has felt up until this this time this movie she has always felt like she has walked in from a different show and in a way which you know, what she does isn't bad but it is I mean imagine putting imagine putting Dietrich Bader into Seinfeld and tell him no, no just do the thing you've been doing on the Drew Carey show do it just like that. But on the Seinfeld where everybody else is you just think oh, no these tones don't match this isn't and she has felt like that the entire time and the character is written her character is written as if she is Selina Meyer pretending to be Nick Fury. Yeah, and that doesn't work because you can be Selina Meyer or you can be Nick Fury Selina Meyer pretending to be Nick Fury is a thing that doesn't compute well.
Sonny00:41:17So I this is 100 you're 100% right. This is my big problem with the movie is all the stuff with valid to Valentina Allegra de Fonte, whatever her name is. I I can't stand this character and I don't like her performance as this character, but mostly I just don't understand what the character is. I don't so like she's introduced in I want to say she's what she is.
JVL00:41:40The character is we don't want to pay Sam Jackson would know.
Sonny00:41:43I mean that is yes, that's that's essentially what's going on here. But it is it is, you know, she is she is introduced I think in Captain America or the Falcon and the Winter Soldier. I think that's where she first shows up and she kind of pops up in this Nick Fury sort of way where it's like she's clearly got we are meant to think she has some sort of grand plan and by the time we actually get to she gets some extended screen time in this show. It's revealed that she doesn't really have much of a grand plan at all. It's like she's kind of fumbling her way through all of this. She's like the head of the CIA. For some reason I don't again. It's you know, you can you can you can be the person in the shadows pulling the strings or you can be or I would I would actually compare her not so much to Selina Meyer but to the what's his name Sam Rockwell in Iron Man 2 you can be like the kind of scheming devious capitalist who wants to who wants to come in and save everything and you know, but you can't you can't do them both that doesn't that. Doesn't work and even if it did work, I like there's not enough background for this character for me to care about what she's doing at all in any of these
JVL00:42:57but she's both devious and kind of incompetent. Yeah, and that's the like I'm sorry this you're not selling this character to us the right way, you know, is she funny is she devious does she know what she's doing does she not know what she's doing like she's basically spinning plates the whole time and that I just think it makes for less interesting emotional core to the movie. This isn't not criticizing Julia Louis-Dreyfus. It is clear to me. She was doing exactly what the filmmakers wanted her to do. You know, I just don't think that this works for the film. Yeah, and like the weirdness like her the relationship that she has with her assistant is straight out of Veep. Yeah, right. So the the Australian Indian girl who plays her assistant who is I mean like, you know, and she that aside where she's like, you know, no matter where we are, you always find me in an amazing cup of coffee. That's like that's that's Selina Meyer. It's not Nick Fury, which is she pick one. Hmm. Sorry. Interesting.
Sonny00:44:03No, I think that's I think that's about right.
Mike00:44:05I do think that's that's so I want to say right out of the gate that I totally disagree with both of you about Julia Louis-Dreyfus's character. I think. She might have been my favorite part of the movie. Oh, interesting. I enjoyed I enjoyed it immensely. I have never seen this character before. I haven't watched any of those TV shows or I get was she in other movies. I have no idea. So this is my first introduction to her and it's interesting that you guys think she's trying to be both Selina Meyer and Nick Fury because my takeaway was, oh, she's like kind of subverting the Selina Meyer thing because like when she starts I'm going. Oh, she's just doing a ripoff of of Veep and then she's but she's very different to me than than Selina Meyer and and Veep like and part of it may be I'm just looking surface level like she doesn't scream, you know, F-bombs and other and like has all of the sort of Armando Iannucci like, you know, vulgar word play that Veep has. So maybe I'm just looking at it on the surface. I thought that the you'd never kind of know what she's what she's doing. Does she have it all under control or does she not? I enjoyed that. I kind of appreciated that. I thought it was a kind of a nice antidote to the Nick Fury. I always know what's going on. There's always a plan at work here. So I realize I'm in the minority on this podcast. Maybe I'm in the minority of people who watch this movie, but I really I really
Guest00:45:44liked her.
Mike00:45:44I really liked her and I like the character.
Sonny00:45:46The thing is Julia Louis-Dreyfus is a good comic actress. She is she is charming even when she is, you know, kind of saddled with a character that doesn't make any sense. So I can totally I get look I can totally buy this the my issue again brought more broadly speaking. Is it just like she keeps showing up in these things and there's no consistency to the character or what she's trying. I like I literally just am not a hundred percent sure what she's doing in these in these roles.
Mike00:46:12Well to to that point again, as I said, I hadn't seen her before. So so for me it it it worked because I this was the only context I had. I also think her feeling like she doesn't belong worked for me as well because this thing felt as you said Sonny like a standalone film like I think I texted you guys as I was about to watch it that like I have no idea what I had no idea what was about. I didn't know what Thunderbolts meant like I didn't know anything and so I went into this movie basically like okay. Let me just take it for what it is and I have to say I really liked it. I really like this Michael. Yes, I enjoyed it for the hang reasons. I enjoyed it for the performances. I agree. This is Florence Pugh's movie and she's just like you just want to keep watching her on screen like she's lovely and she's she's she's great. She's lovely, but she's also. She's doing a lot of stuff in her acting is my is my very sophisticated way of saying she act good. She act good and she out real good. She carries the high and she does it very lightly. Totally. I totally agree. I think to take a page out of Sonny's book here. I think they're the reason this movie works and it works for me is that there is an idea at the center. Of it, which we should all be in group therapy. No, actually. So here's the thing. I think the surface level read on it is like, oh, this is the movie about therapy. This is a movie about group therapy and getting in touch with your feelings. And I actually think that the idea behind this movie is no, you don't need therapy. What you need are people around you and purpose in your life and because ultimately what saves the day in this movie is that like the people who have been who have been kind of holding up Bob as they've met him as they've sort of gone on this little adventure to try to escape from being killed like those are the people and the for I don't like the overuse of the word community, but like he has this like little family or community around him and that's what saves him from from the enveloping Darkness and saves everybody from the enveloping Darkness not the therapy. I mean, maybe you could say that what happens going back into these into these, uh, you know traumatic experiences, but to me it was it's the forward-looking aspect of it, which I think is an interesting idea to like explore in a movie, especially in in a movie in in a in at a time when it does feel like like therapy culture is like saturates everything. I thought it kind of subtly some. Subverted that maybe I was just looking for that. Maybe I'm just looking for a message that isn't there, but I was intrigued by the way in which the way with the way which the movie used the people around him to to pull them out. So there you go. There's my there's my take on it.
Sonny00:49:39What's so I mean, I think I think that's how I think that's all about right. I mean, I do think I mean we can we can discuss whether group therapy is the same as community or whatever. But I like I do think that I it's it's it's a it's it is a movie about people who are searching for purpose and find it. That is what that is. What the because this is this is the arc of all these characters, right? Like Yelena wants to be she wants to be a hero. She wants to be yes. She wants to be the public face that like Black Widow was, you know, she wants to she wants to be heroic like her sister John Walker wants to be Captain America. He he.
JVL00:50:15Just wants his kids back.
Sonny00:50:17He wants his kids back.
JVL00:50:18I just want my kids back.
Sonny00:50:19He wants and again like this guy is the most this guy is the most sympathetic person. This guy is the most sympathetic like anti-hero or whatever in it because he's he's sitting there. He's like doom scrolling on his phone. His wife's like, why are you looking at the child? And he's like the child's right here. Baby's right here. I'm fine. Baby's fine. I got things to look at on my phone. We've all been there. We've all been there. You know, I don't I ghost mask or these these characters are interchangeable. I don't like they could have killed either ghost or Taskmaster. I almost wonder if they just flipped a coin. We're like who is cheaper to get. Is it old?
JVL00:50:57It's more expensive. Yeah, Olga is more expensive. That's why Taskmaster had to die.
Mike00:51:03We'll have her face looking at the camera for two seconds before we
Sonny00:51:07get rid of her. Well, I mean that that whole sequence is very funny. But yeah, no, I mean I like it's a movie again. It's a movie and like. Bucky Barnes right Bucky Barnes is is he is he a hero or is he a faceless congressman who has no real power? Like where does his power come from? Does it come from being able to legislate?
JVL00:51:26Well, this is and this is why he sidekick who no longer has his principle.
Sonny00:51:31Yeah. Well, he's going to have to be Black Widows or he's going to have to be Elena's sidekick from now on because that's that's what's going on on. Anyway, I like I yeah, I it's a movie. It's a movie with an idea. It's a discreet chunk of storytelling and again what this calls to mind is not is not the it's not that it's better than the lesser recent Marvel movies. It's that it's as good as Captain America. The first Avenger. It's as good as the first yes, right like it's basically in that range where those movies were fine. They were fine. They were building to something else. Now the real problem Marvel has here is that they are jumping straight. They're going to do they're doing this. They're doing Fantastic Four, which is basically set in another universe is my understanding and they're going to cross the quantum streams, whatever.
Mike00:52:20So spoiler spoiler a question that involves a spoiler. So the thing at the end at the because I stuck around because I heard there was a stinger post credits.
Sonny00:52:30There's post. I didn't stick around for that. What was it?
Mike00:52:32I suppose credit singer. There's like the little Fantastic Four ship right that shows up. That's fantastic cars. You mean?
Sonny00:52:39No, it's a spaceship. It's Fantastic Four spaceship hurtling towards Earth, but nobody knows what it is. What? What is this thing? So it's clearly they're breaching, you know, whatever the okay.
Mike00:52:49Sorry, I interrupt. I just want to make sure that that was what that was.
Sonny00:52:52Okay, you did. You couldn't tell from the big four on it.
Mike00:52:57But like but I don't understand why it was in space. But now, well, I'm coming from a different universe.
Sonny00:53:05Mike Michael, the the Fantastic Four was a family of astronauts that went into space and due to the bombardment by the cosmic rays were able to gain superpowers. There was Mr. Fantastic. Who can stretch there's Ben Grimm who turns into a rock monster. There's Johnny Storm who is the fireman and then there's Sue
Mike00:53:21Storm the Invisible Woman, but they live on Earth.
Sonny00:53:25Yes. So why would this is why I get this is why when they're coming to Earth and nobody has any idea what they are. That's clearly that's what that's what I was getting. Yeah.
Guest00:53:33Okay.
Mike00:53:33Yeah, I get your little nerd comic book world a little bit. I just have to do I just have to think about the Fantastic Four
Sonny00:53:41is that they're the first superheroes of Marvel Silver Age. So Marvel really. He keeps trying to make the Fantastic Four happen. And the problem is nobody has liked the Fantastic Four in 50 years the Fantastic Four there except for a very brief moment in the mid-1990s when Jim Lee and Rob Liefeld rebooted the core superhero groups in the in the Marvel, you know comic book universe. Nobody has liked Fantastic Four. It's it's a it's a terrible book. Nobody has nobody has enjoyed it.
JVL00:54:09Mark Millar's Ultimate Fantastic Four run was pretty good
Sonny00:54:12there and there's a John Byrne run in the 1980s. It was. But that isn't terrible.
JVL00:54:15But like it's a it's a tough tough, but the nerds love them. Right? And so, you know, I gotta do it. So but we're going to jump as you were saying Sonny straight from Fantastic Four to like three different Avengers movies,
Sonny00:54:34but like Fantastic Four does not take place in this in this right? Like it takes place elsewhere. It takes place.
JVL00:54:40Another way. It's going to be a year before we get another actual Marvel movie and it's that in the MCU and they're going
Sonny00:54:48straight to the Avengers and this is this is a disaster. They are they are barreling towards disaster here. Like I don't care if you have I mean it's going to have a big opening weekend because people are Robert Downey Jr. Dr. Noom. Yay and like whatever there's going to be a whole thing.
JVL00:55:05It's like the Avengers after Iron Man, but it's exactly
Sonny00:55:09that's exactly what this is.
JVL00:55:11Iron Man comes out in 2008 Avengers in 2012 imagine if they had done. Avengers in 2009 instead.
Sonny00:55:17You know what? You know what it is. It's panda. It is the Joss Whedon Zack Zack Snyder Justice League movie because they are they like you have you have at least enough of a foundation that you can kind of jump into this thing. But like remember they they do you know instead of doing Wonder Woman before Justice League. Right or instead of doing Wonder Woman before Batman versus Superman they do like Man of Steel Batman. For Superman and then start shooting Justice League and like it's it's just the whole now Wonder Woman comes out before Justice League. If I remember correctly and it did it did well but like I don't know the whole thing was the whole thing was a mess the brand
JVL00:55:58new day the Spider-Man movie comes out just like eight weeks after Avengers Doomsday, right? So that takes place of them star RDJ question.
Mike00:56:10How will RDJ play a different character? In the MCU and have oh, I'm sorry.
Sonny00:56:18Oh, I'm sorry Mike universe shut out. Just be quiet. You're exposing your ignorance.
JVL00:56:23No, what he is is he's saying I lost my virginity at 14 motherfucker.
Sonny00:56:27I can't that's what he's saying. I don't understand how different universes and comic books could
JVL00:56:33possibly work with the other time continuum get it together. Tony Stark was evil and became Victor Von Doom and instead of becoming so so it is Tony Stark who is Victor Von
Sonny00:56:49Doom clear unclear. I mean, you know, he's gonna be Victor Von Doom, but he'll be Victor Von Doom who has experienced an entire different set of life experiences than Tony Stark. What if Tony Stark's dad had just like dropped him off in Latvia for a while Latveria left area not Latvia.
JVL00:57:06What if you know, he's an inventor. They're very similar characters. They're very similar people.
Mike00:57:14Okay, is there any other thoughts on the what is this movie called
JVL00:57:20Thunderbolts part of me is rooting for the bottom to fall out on the MCU and that's a very strange place for me to be because I went through a decade where I genuinely enjoyed 70% of the Marvel movies. Like I think the Avengers is a perfect movie. I think the first Captain America movie is good. The first Thor movie is fine and serviceable. The first Iron Man is civil war. Iron Man 3 is great. I really love that Winter Soldier is great. The first Ant-Man is Peyton Reed's kind of fun. Civil War is okay. Doctor Strange is kind of interesting. Then you get to the first of the Spider-Man's with Chris McKenna the homecoming, which is great. Black Panther is great, right? And again, that's a run. That's 10 years. That's a decade of my life in which the idea that there would be a new Marvel movie wasn't a sure thing, but it was like hey, there's a pretty good chance that I'm going to go see this and I'm going to have a good time. And that has not been true now for half a decade and part of me wants to see the entire thing really really burn to the ground. So that I mean, yeah, something new can happen. I don't know. Maybe I maybe nothing new will happen like maybe that maybe what what happens is the James Gunn actually does something interesting in the DC Universe and it turns out we really like the new James Gunn DCU. Maybe maybe that'll be a thing. I don't know. You know Superman is wearing his his underpants on the outside. Now. They've got Guy Gardner.
Sonny00:59:00Are you excited for Guy Gardner? I want a Guy Gardner TV show. I want 20 hours with Guy Gardner. I want like a Guy Gardner Bar Rescue where he just goes from bar to
Mike00:59:09bar. Which one is he who plays him? What's this?
Sonny00:59:14With the bowl cut.
Mike00:59:16That's right.
JVL00:59:17They've been filming. I mean, look, I'm sorry. I think this movie is likely to be terrible, but I don't know. Maybe it'll be different enough and there will be an idea behind it. Sonny, you do you know something about?
Sonny00:59:30Do I know something? I don't know anything about anything.
JVL00:59:32You don't know anything about the James Gunn Superman.
Sonny00:59:35I have I know as much as anybody else. I mean, I like have watched it coming out. They're fine.
JVL00:59:41A couple weeks.
Sonny00:59:42It comes out in June comes out. Like wow. Okay, end of the mid-June.
Mike00:59:46I think let's get let's keep our chins up gentlemen. Like this. This could be this could be something something fun. Something to look forward to this summer.
Sonny00:59:55July 11th, July 11th.
Mike00:59:57Look at that. Look at that.
Sonny00:59:58All right.
Mike01:00:00Okay. Well, if there are no more thoughts, that's all we're all the time. We're going to give to this episode. Remember to join us over at sub beacon.com. Tell your friends and family and we'll talk to you next time. Yeah, I I saw the Fantastic Four trailer before the movie and it looks really dumb and bad.
JVL01:00:34You know what though? It looks like the best Fantastic Four movie to come out in 30 years.
Sonny01:00:40It does. No, I mean like I it looks like it looks like. At the very least it looks like they're trying to do a thing, right? They're trying to do a thing with it, which is like we're going to situate it in 1960 and this is the era of optimism and you know, like I at least respect the idea behind it. We'll see if it's any good. It probably won't be any good. I mean, maybe it'll be great. I don't know, but I am.
JVL01:01:07It doesn't have Vanessa Kirby in it.
Sonny01:01:09It looks intentionally cheesy. Mike, it looks intentionally. Cheesy like that's the whole point is like remember the 1960s and the idea of the space race and like I have I have a question Sonny.
JVL01:01:23Yeah, so we got a look at Fantastic Four in I don't know one of the was it Endgame. Was that the one that showed us the the eternal like the other the other plane and it was John Krasinski playing Reed Richards. I think that was that was Doctor Strange 2, right? Did they go through cast? In changes to one. No, no. Well, no, they ask gal or no, that was they just abandoned that whole thing when the Kang thing blew up.
Sonny01:01:51No, that was that was just like fan service because there was a there was a long time like you should have you should have John Krasinski and Emily Blunt as Mr. Fantastic and Mrs. Fantastic, you know, like I like that. That would be, you know, that was that that's essentially what that was.
Mike01:02:07I did not realize that. Can I say something? I'm getting a little tired of Pedro Pascal. Like he doesn't really.
Sonny01:02:13Yeah, that much. For me. Yeah, he's everywhere all the time. And it's it's and I don't find him that interesting.
Mike01:02:19Frankly, I agree.
JVL01:02:21Agree. I really liked him in the Nick Cage movie.
Sonny01:02:26Yeah, that's he's a good comic actor, I think.
JVL01:02:30I think that does.
Sonny01:02:31I think that does play to his strengths more than. And look, I think he was fine. He's fine in The Last of Us. Like Last of Us was the first season of Last of Us. He is a fun show. He's very good. I've never seen it. Did you guys notice? Did you? So. JVL, did you leave the minute the credit started? Were you out of there?
Mike01:02:47The minute.
Sonny01:02:48Mike, you stayed all through them.
Mike01:02:50Yes, I did.
Sonny01:02:51You stayed. So you you so you saw the like headlines. There's like a headline of there's like a montage of headlines. It's like the new Avengers Thunder Thunder. Who are the new Avengers? Can they do it? Blah, blah, blah. But did you notice? Did you notice who is who had one of the bylines?
Mike01:03:09Yes.
Sonny01:03:11David Brooks. David Brooks is officially. Part of the MCU. I want a David Brooks TV show. I want I want him doing like the his PBS show where he's interviewing the people and talking about talking about MCU stuff. That's what I want. I want I want if I you put me in charge of Marvel and there's going to be a five minute episode every week on Disney Plus. That's just David Brooks talking MCU stuff. Real David. The actual David Brooks. Not not some phony David Brooks. So I would get the real David Brooks on there. It's.
Mike01:03:43Does Bobo's in Paradise exist in in the.
Sonny01:03:47Yeah, but it's got it's got to be something. It's got to be super Bobo's in. Yes, super Bobo's. Super super Bobo's in the multiverse.
JVL01:03:55Super Bobo's and Bobo's in Wakanda.
Sonny01:03:58But what what's his version of that? I mean, I tell me, tell me status. And this movie is the status income disequilibrium movie. They these superheroes. It's powers. The superheroes have the power, but they don't have the status. And they're working through it. It's fine.
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