#93. 'The Batman'
Listen to this episode ↗on Substack, where the show lives now
The main review is Matt Reeves's The Batman (2022), and for once all three hosts are in rare, grumpy unanimity: nobody likes it. Sonny calls it a mess that "doesn't work on basically any level," arguing the last 40 minutes (the Riddler's sea-wall flooding plot) come out of nowhere and are never set up, that Paul Dano's Riddler is beat-for-beat just Heath Ledger's Joker with a different prop, and that Zoe Kravitz's Catwoman and her whole family subplot are extraneous and should be cut. JVL says the film is "bereft of ideas," complains it's a small, low-stakes story bloated to an unearned three-hour runtime full of throwaway characters and pointlessly dark cinematography (even a lit Madison Square Garden watch party is shot as if in a blackout), and singles out Robert Pattinson as working as Batman but not as Bruce Wayne. Vic scores it Quadrant C (plot) / F (duration) / A (action-violence) / D (sex-nudity) for a C-minus overall, though like the others he singles out Colin Farrell's fat-suited Penguin and Michael Giacchino's score as the film's few bright spots. The episode opens with its usual long banter stretch: JVL raves about his new $20/month Alamo Drafthouse "season pass" and seeing The Batman twice (plus a plan to drag Vic to a bonus-episode rewatch of Almost Famous), the trio riff on Entenmann's vs. Hostess snack-cake loyalties and Revenge of the Nerds, and Vic confesses to fishing a days-old bagel out of the trash (in a sealed Ziploc, he insists) and eating it, earning comparisons to Homer Simpson's radioactive sandwich. They also note The Batman's $134 million opening weekend, easily #1 over Uncharted and Dog.
From the show notes
On this week's episode, JVL makes an investment and Vic pulls a Homer. And the gang ... kind of hates The Batman ?
Full transcript
Guest00:00:00*Dramatic music plays* Oh, take it easy, sweetheart. Hear everything they say, ain't ya? *Dramatic music plays* Maybe we're not so different. Who are you under there? I'm vengeance.
Vic00:00:26*Dramatic music plays* Hello, and welcome to another edition of the Sub-Beacon. I'm Victor Matus along with Jonathan V. Last and Sonny Bunch. Just a reminder, the Sub-Beacon's now available through Patreon. Go to subbeacon.com, you'll easily find us. Please subscribe, tell your friends, and don't forget about the Sub-Beacon merchandise store at Tee Public. Gentlemen, how are we, JVL?
JVL00:01:01Two things. Number one, look what I'm wearing. Yes.
Sonny00:01:07Oh yeah, we got the text from your lovely wife. And I almost texted back, that looks like a really fun MLS game they're going to. Yeah, well we're gonna get Red Bull. I didn't want you to get offended.
JVL00:01:19We're gonna get Red Bull patches. It's gonna be great.
Vic00:01:22Etihad. I go for Etihad. Dubai air. Dubai, yes.
JVL00:01:26So I am concerned that we have hit a moment of unsustainability. Because when I went to purchase my theater ticket for The Batman.
Sonny00:01:43The Batman!
JVL00:01:45I was gonna just purchase it on the Alamo Drafthouse's website for $16. In 1999, I could do the Alamo's Movie Pass. It has a real name, but I'm not gonna call it the real name. Alamo has their own version of Movie Pass.
Sonny00:02:06The Season Pass or something, isn't that what they call it?
JVL00:02:09$20 a month, and you can see a movie a day. No exceptions.
Vic00:02:18I know you would want to see a movie a day, but can you see... No blackouts, no nothing. You want to see a movie a day, but can you see a movie a day? So, obviously I'm not going to, but...
Sonny00:02:28You should, I mean, that pays for itself in two trips. We go see more than two movies a month.
JVL00:02:33Well, that's what I want, and so I just did it. And I just did it, and you know what? It feels like a whole, because the Alamo has so much great programming. For instance, they're gonna have Almost Famous later this month. No! And, you know, ordinarily, you might say to yourself, "Oh, I'd like to go see Almost Famous on a Thursday night." But then you'd think, "Look, there's five million reasons not to." But taking the $15 or $12 or whatever it is off the table, it moves you that much closer. And I don't know, why don't we all, why isn't everybody in America just paying the Alamo $20 a month so they can go see however many movies they want?
Sonny00:03:14So, they have not restarted that program in Dallas. I was like on the wait list for it. And everything shut down and they haven't restarted it. But when they do restart it, I'm totally going to sign up for it. I mean, it's an amazing deal. It's a wonderful deal. But here's two things. First off, they may have changed this, I don't know. But when you sign up for it, you still have to pay the $1.30 something. Yes, the convenience fee. Convenience fee on the app.
JVL00:03:50I want these people to succeed. I will pay that.
Sonny00:03:54That's right. But so here's the other thing. I have never quite understood what the actual, maybe you know JBL, but I've never actually, I've never quite understood what the actual financial breakdown on these are. So, like, in theory, right, a $20 monthly pass goes right to Alamo and then you're not buying the ticket, which would, you know, usually be split 70/30. Say, between the studio and the theater. So, I've never quite understood how that breaks down. If, like, every time you go to a movie via this pass, the Alamo Drafthouse or AMC with their, you know, their season pass type thing. I don't know if they're, like, just cutting a, like, $12 check to the studios. I don't quite understand how it works.
JVL00:04:49I don't know either. But I believe that this is... They're only shot at surviving streaming. Which is to convert movie going. Because this also... This will work as a thing so long as we still have some new releases. But eventually there won't be any new releases exclusive to theaters. Right? The window will be closed. You could see everything. And it'll just be choosing to spend $20 on the Alamo in addition to your $13 on Netflix and your $17 on Disney+. Because you want to be able to go and see back catalog stuff. Like Almost Famous. Yeah. Right? This is what it'll be. And it's like a date night. People like to get out of the house. This is why... Because I tell you, the other thing they do is... I had the Edward Nygma popcorn.
Sonny00:05:38Did you? Oh! Was it good? I didn't get it. So I went to go... I actually...
Vic00:05:44Is this the sweet and salty combination of... With churros in it. It's popcorn with churros in it.
Sonny00:05:51With churros in it. With churro bites. I didn't get that when I went to the... When I went... I actually went and saw Batman again for a second time.
Vic00:05:58Oh.
Sonny00:05:59Because it was so good. Wow. So I could do this show. Yeah.
?00:06:03Jesus.
Sonny00:06:04Be fresh. We'll talk about that more later. But I just got the regular popcorn instead of the... Because I wasn't sure... Does it come with the free refill? If you get the Edward Nygma popcorn, do you get the refill?
JVL00:06:14Let me tell you. I finished my thing of popcorn and I was curious about that, but there was zero chance that I could have... Yeah. Another bowl of it.
Sonny00:06:22You would have died.
JVL00:06:23I was... I would have died. Have you... Does your Alamo have as an additional popcorn, the choice of Parmesan cheese? Yeah. And or truffle oil? Truffle.
Sonny00:06:36Truffle. Truffle. Truffle. Salt oil. Yeah. Truffle oil. Yeah. That's... This is why... Too rich for my blood. Too rich for my blood. It's the best.
Vic00:06:48It's the best. It's actually... I don't like... I don't... I actually don't like truffle. I think it... It actually gives me heartburn. No. You know what you don't... What you don't like is the fact that most truffle oil, it's just a chemical base that's an imitation of it. It's not like they're shaving the truffle on it.
JVL00:06:55Oh, no. No, I'm sure that at the Alamo, they're shaving the truffles. It's... They've got... They actually have the pig from the Nicolas Cage movie. They've got Nicolas Cage's pig.
Sonny00:07:01Yeah. Yeah. They've got... Yeah. Yeah. Each Alamo Drafthouse, they send the pig around from place to place. I used to remember the name of the chemical name. I can't remember it right now.
JVL00:07:08Anyway, so that's what I've been doing. And anyway, I just feel like whole new vistas are open to me now that I can just go see... And in fact, I'm taking G-Money, the movies on Saturday morning. To see Almost Famous? Because Spider- No Way Home is back out. Maybe it never left, but it hasn't been at the Alamo in a while. It's still in the box office. It's still collecting. And...
Sonny00:07:30Yeah, it's still top five.
JVL00:07:31It hasn't been in my Alamo for a while, and it's back. And I thought, "Well, one of these tickets is free. Boom. Let's just do this."
Sonny00:07:37That's right. I mean, look, it's a good deal for the Alamo because the whole point is to get you in there so you're buying the popcorn and the soda and the beers and the wine and the sandwiches. And the chocolate chip cookies.
JVL00:07:48Tony is very, very specific about what he wants for this. He wants the chicken tenders for lunch. He got a whole meal in there. He wants the popcorn to munch on, and he wants the chocolate chip cookies, which I don't know if you've ever had there, but they come out fresh baked and moist and gooey, and they are delicious. Yeah. I've still never been to an Alamo. Vic, what are you doing? If it's not 10 minutes away, I'm not going. It's on like Ashburn, right?
Vic00:08:16I don't even know. Oh. No, it's in Woodbridge. Oh, like I said. Okay. Well, good for you, though. Lucky for you, there's an Alamo. It's too bad there's not one. There used to be ... There was an Arlington Drafthouse at Columbia Pike, but I don't think that's the same. It's still there. That's still there.
Sonny00:08:28Is it the same? I still get emails about it.
Vic00:08:30Oh, really? I'm pretty sure it's still there. I think they're probably showing the Rocky Horror Picture Show there, is what they're
Sonny00:08:33doing. Well, they do. It's interesting. The last two or three times I went to the Arlington Drafthouse, it was to see stand-up comedy. It was not to see a movie, because it doubles as a live comedy. Oh, I see.
JVL00:08:45Yeah.
Sonny00:08:46What did you see? God, I saw Jay Moore there. I saw Jay Sandra Sharkar from the ... Shadja Sarkar.
Vic00:08:53... The Rogan Lizard.
Sonny00:08:54Yes. Yeah. Troupe. Who?
Vic00:08:58Jay Sandra Sharkar. Jay Moore. Jersey guy. Jay Moore. Bob Sugar. Yeah, Bob Sugar.
Sonny00:09:04Most famously is Bob Sugar. That's right. Jay Moore was definitely ... It was definitely back end of a comedian's career, Jay Moore.
JVL00:09:15Oh. So he'd gotten fat?
Sonny00:09:17No, no, no. Not that.
JVL00:09:19Not that. He just like-
Sonny00:09:21Oh, because he did get very fat.
Vic00:09:22Yeah, no. He was a big exercise freak for a while and he would be like a co-host. He would guest host on Regis and Kelly when Regis wasn't there and stuff and he'd be always shown off his guns and things like that. Really? Yeah. And then ... And then.
Guest00:09:34And then, right?
Vic00:09:35That happens. So you saw him post Jerry Maguire, is what you're saying. Yeah.
Sonny00:09:39I mean, I saw him like three years ago. Three years ago.
JVL00:09:42I don't know. Four years ago.
Vic00:09:44It wasn't that long ago.
JVL00:09:45He was one of those cast members who got lost in the shuffle in the same way Julia Louis-Dreyfus- Yeah. That's crazy. ... was a cast member for half a season there.
Sonny00:09:53That's crazy. Jennifer Aniston. That's crazy. He and Chris Rock, same thing. Yeah. Chris Rock. That whole era. Yeah. Yeah.
?00:10:02Yeah.
Sonny00:10:03Yeah. He didn't have Jim Brewer's talent.
Vic00:10:05Ouch. Ouch. Good for you, JVL. I hope you enjoy ... You should see, I'd love to see Almost Famous again.
Sonny00:10:12We should go together.
JVL00:10:14It's hardly seen- The minute the trailer came on, I just thought to myself, "Oh, yeah."
Vic00:10:19And the music is so good, and it's like the music-
JVL00:10:23Philip Seymour Hoffman.
Vic00:10:24Oh. Oh.
JVL00:10:26It's Lester Bangs.
Vic00:10:27Because he's the trailer, right? He's the voice of the trailer. Why don't we do that for a bonus? I'd love to do that for a bonus.
Sonny00:10:31Let's do that for a bonus. You guys should go together. You can pop-fix Cherry at the Alamo Drafthouse.
JVL00:10:36Victorino, let me sweeten the deal.
Sonny00:10:39That's not popcorn.
JVL00:10:40Let me sweeten the deal for you. You come out here to the Alamo- Yeah. And then afterwards, we can come back to my house, and you can Oculus.
Vic00:10:48We will find a time.
JVL00:10:51You can jump on the Oculus, and you can fight, because this is the thing. With the Star Wars game, you fight with Darth Vader, not against. You're on his side.
Vic00:11:03Well, they know what we want. They know what the people want. I'm like, "I don't want to defeat Darth Vader." This is like, I guess if you go to ... This was like this on the Disney Cruise, and I think it's like it. I don't know if it's like that if you go to Disney World now, but they just automatically assume you want to be a rebel, and I'm like, "No, who would want to do that?" No, thanks.
JVL00:11:24If you come out here, I will A, I'll buy your ticket to the Alamo.
Vic00:11:28I'd be the guest.
JVL00:11:29That's exciting. And then we can play Star Wars on the Oculus together.
Sonny00:11:33Speaking of Star Wars ...
JVL00:11:35Oh, hey, do you want to talk about it now, or save it for the bonus?
Vic00:11:37Do you want to talk about it now? I was thinking we could talk about the bonus if you want, or we could talk about it now.
Sonny00:11:42I guess we could save it for the bonus. Yeah, I'd say ... Did you not do the reading, Vic?
Vic00:11:46I flipped through it. Did you not do the assigned reading? I think I caught the gist of it. I really didn't care. I don't read about movies, as you know. I did the reading. So it's going to be on you guys.
Sonny00:11:55All right, fine. We'll save that for the- Okay, so those of you who are listening to this-
Vic00:11:58That and Obi-Wan Kenobi. We are going to talk about, in addition to this interesting article, we're going to talk about the Obi-Wan Kenobi trailer.
Sonny00:12:05Here I am. I'm trying to save you time and effort. I know. I know. Here's a 15-minute story to read.
JVL00:12:12I think I put five minutes in it. Sonny, that's 15 minutes for you to read at a fixed pace.
Vic00:12:17I'm like, I don't even know what's happening. I don't even understand half the- Who are these people? Hold on.
JVL00:12:22Hold on. Pause. Sorry. Pause. Are you ready?
Vic00:12:27Wait. Vic, you actually paused. Yeah.
JVL00:12:30No. I'm frozen. Why? What do I-
?00:12:34Okay.
JVL00:12:35Here's- I want to read it just as a- But Bazile had cachet among a new clique of Instagram-obsessed Manhattan scene-sters. Thank you. Yeah.
Vic00:12:44I was like, how do I Google translate that to me for me?
Sonny00:12:47I want to get a ranking from JVL. I was going to spring this on. I want to get a ranking from JVL of the worst people in that story. Okay.
JVL00:12:55I'll just tease people. I'm just going to tease people with this. We read this story, and the whole time- This is a story on Buzzfeed. The whole time, I'm thinking to myself, I want to kill everybody in this. The story ends in what it's supposed to, I believe, from by the author, be a tragic denouement. And I thought to myself, oh, it has a happy ending.
Vic00:13:16Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Okay. All right. Well, we'll see. All right. So tune in, subscribe for the bonus episode. Sonny Bunch, what's going on?
Sonny00:13:25I was just saying, right before the show started, JVL was chugging something. Something out of a can.
JVL00:13:31Fizzy water.
Sonny00:13:32It's just fizzy water. Fizzy water. And it was just very amusing to me, because my three-year-old son has started to do that so he can burp. He's hit that point of boyhood. Where he will drink something, and he'll drink it as fast as possible, just so he can burp afterwards, and then laugh and laugh about it. It's very, very funny.
Vic00:13:55He'll be like, he can enter the competition in Revenge of the Nerds, remember that? The burping contest. Oh. It was Ogre versus Booger. Booger?
JVL00:14:04Yes.
Vic00:14:05A classic, a classic movie. And Booger won. I think Booger won.
JVL00:14:10A classic movie in which the denouement is date rape?
Guest00:14:13No, it was... Well, no, that's not the... Romantic date rape? No, no, no.
Vic00:14:17That's like... Halfway through the movie. She thought it was Ted McGinley. That's fine. It was a different time. It was a different time.
Sonny00:14:23In the Mood Bounce house. It's... She's wearing a mask, you know.
Vic00:14:26Yeah, she thought it was Ted McGinley. Ted McGinley?
JVL00:14:28Ted McGinley. Okay. And that was something the hero did.
Vic00:14:31But, you know, okay, so, that's what's going on with you, Sonny. That's what's going on with me. That's it.
Sonny00:14:39There's nothing else. I got nothing else. I was... Like I said, we can talk about the...
Vic00:14:43We'll talk a little bit more about the draft house. I could talk about Almost Famous forever. It's like the reason why you went into journalism, except for none of those things happened to me. But it's like the reason why you would want to go into journalism, to be covering these bands and have all these crazy experiences and serious, really insane shoe leather reporting and whatever. And, you know, speaking of Almost Famous, do you know what I started reading today? To Kill a Mockingbird.
JVL00:15:07Have you read... No, wait.
Vic00:15:09Don't tell me. Don't tell me. It's really interesting.
Sonny00:15:13Why? Why did you start reading To Kill a Mockingbird?
Vic00:15:17My son's reading it. My son's reading it. So he said, here, here's another one I can read. I feel like I'm just going through eighth grade again. This is different. The books I've never read.
JVL00:15:24So he said, they made a novel adaptation of the... They novelized?
Sonny00:15:29Because I did see the movie. The Gregory Peck movie? I did see... They novelized the Aaron Sorkin play? Oh, that's even worse.
Vic00:15:35I did. I did see. I did see the movie.
Sonny00:15:38So when he's in 10th grade and you finish it, how... How do you think he's going to... How do you think he's going to... The ending.
Vic00:15:46What are you guys going to talk about? I wish you hadn't out seen the movie then. I'd be like, ooh, what's going to happen here? Who to believe? Are you sure? Shiffer Road. Okay. So I do want to say this. As you know, we all have our issues, our various obsessive compulsions, and as you know, one of mine, there are many, but one of mine is, of course, I hate to see food go to waste. Right? Sure. And I don't know if this was rock bottom. Or this is like, it's time to check into a clinic because a couple of days ago, it's a very Costanza like moment. The garbage, I'm about to throw something in garbage and there's something in there. There was a bagel, but it was in a Ziploc, it was sealed. It was sealed in a Ziploc, and I said, what is this doing in here? So I lifted up. I don't see any evidence of any mold or anything whatsoever. Kate says it'd been there for eight days, it was time to throw it out or however long. I don't see anything. I didn't tell her I did this at the time. So I took it out of the Ziploc. It was in the trash. I took it out, sliced it open, I toasted it and I had a bagel and cream cheese. Now I normally don't even eat breakfast, but I had it because I didn't want to see it go to waste. And then she walks down and I'm just sort of quietly eating and she stops because she knows there are no bagels and she just turns around. Did you get that out of the trash? And I said it was in a Ziploc and she just shook and she goes, Yeah, well, good luck with that.
Sonny00:17:20This is this is like I know I've made this reference before in regard to you, Vic, but this is like the Simpsons episode where Homer cannot get rid of the giant sandwich and it almost kills it. The sandwich almost kills him. It almost kills it because he keeps getting like moldier and there's like mushrooms growing off the top of it.
Vic00:17:37But he had to eat it.
Sonny00:17:38And he just kept he kept like he's like found up from behind the radiator. And it was all brown.
Vic00:17:44Right. Even when it was rotting and he still ate the sandwich. It's true.
Sonny00:17:49That's that is you're you're a real life Homer Simpsons. You're the Asian Homer Homer Simpson is really the Filipino American Homer Homer Simpsons.
JVL00:17:57It's funny that our grandparents had that because their childhood memories were of the depression. Deprivation.
Sonny00:18:04Yeah.
JVL00:18:05Vic, you're the son of a doctor. You don't have any excuse for this.
Vic00:18:10No. And we threw you know, like if you didn't finish. This plate and you put the plate. I don't know where. But it really bothers me that I can't I got to have this. The other thing is Kate bought. That's sick. It's sick. I haven't.
Sonny00:18:23You got to go. You got to go to a doctor. See a doctor for this. You need to see a brain doctor there.
Vic00:18:28So she bought like this off the Whole Foods and what brought this awful knockoff version of Whole Foods version of Cinnamon Toast Crunch. It's so bad. So nobody wanted to eat it. So I took the bag. And I brought it with me to the office. And I want to go to the team. Yeah, I took it. And I'll like pour it into a cup because sometimes I just need and it's it's like cardboard. It's lit. It makes Snackwell's taste like Oreo double stuff. That's how bad it is. You're going to.
Sonny00:18:56Yes. Can I ask a question? I feel like this is a big question. Okay. The the the the guy who I get I don't think he quite founded Entenmann's. But the guy who turned into a like national presence. Yes. What is your favorite Entenmann's?
Vic00:19:14You know, it's funny because I what I really loved was Hostess and even Tasty Cakes because, you know, the crumb cake thing is incredible. And that should have been, you know, for me, that would have been the great Edmund's thing. But that was the only thing really Edmund's I've had is their their version of a strudel with the white icing on top. You can't we don't have video here, so you can't see my hand doing the laces going back and forth. It's going back. It's jagging off. The white icing. It's the white icing.
Sonny00:19:43With the white icing. He's moving his hand right in his lap and now white icing is shooting everywhere.
Vic00:19:47It was all over the place and it was nice and moist. JVL, you're shaking your head.
JVL00:19:51The the the mini chocolate chip cookies, which were soft, soft baked, and I believe may have been the first mass market soft bake cookie product.
Vic00:20:06Before Almost Home, like it predated Almost Home.
JVL00:20:09And the number one of the. One of the joys of becoming a quasi adult, you know, once once, you know, I would have sometimes as many as $10 in my wallet would be being super hungry and realizing fuck it, man. I could just go go over to ShopRite and buy a box of Entenmann's for 299 and eat the whole thing myself.
Vic00:20:35Yeah, yeah. Oh, you could do that without any consequences.
Sonny00:20:40No consequences. I mean, that that's the thing is it is you can't really do that anymore just because
Vic00:20:45no, there are a lot of things on that, you know, it was slightly processed. Sorry, did you have it in favor?
Sonny00:20:50Were you in it? I didn't. I didn't. And that's why I was kind of curious to ask because I like I it all tasted I don't want to I don't want to say that I don't want to say this dismissively because I don't mean it dismissively, but it all kind of tasted the same to me. Like I never really understood the appeal of the end, like all that stuff, all that was hostess, et cetera. It all was like interchangeable to me. And there's like a whole cult of Entenmann's. Yeah.
Vic00:21:18No, I'm I'm team hostess and your life will change if you ever get their cherry pie. So anyway, it was much it's much better than the the whole foods. I mean, this is I'd rather have a small amount of Entenmann's.
JVL00:21:32Hostess was my second favorite cherry pie.
Vic00:21:35Oh, thank you for video. You're missing the video. But the the. I'd rather have a small amount of Entenmann's or Whole Foods than, you know, a large amount of this. For example, this Whole Foods knockoff Cinnamon Toast Crunch Cardboard, which, by the way, the only good thing about it is it's an excellent source of fiber. Speaking of massive blowouts over the weekend, the the Batman obliterated obliterated the box office with one hundred and thirty four million dollars or half Spiderman. Yes. Followed. Followed by Uncharted with eleven point one million. And in third place, Dog again with six point one million. Sonny, you're like Nostradamus box office thoughts.
Sonny00:22:21I just want to say for the record, JBL put me on the spot, said, what do you think it's going to do? And I was like, well, I could do this, but I think it's probably going to do between one hundred and thirty and one hundred forty million. One thirty four. Amazing. I don't really have I don't really have any box office odds.
Vic00:22:38I mean, you I mean, you you predicted it. But were you surprised in any way about this or JBL? Were you surprised by the number?
Sonny00:22:45I mean, I think it could have gone higher. It was hurt by the fact that, again, it's it's three hours long, you know, with previews and everything. You get to show times a night and like the second one starts at ten, you know, fifteen or whatever. Yeah, that's the so that that that's a problem. You know, it did. It did. It did. Well, it did. It did pretty well. But as far as these things go, I'm very curious to see how it holds this weekend because it's getting decent. Like people seem to like it. People seem to like it more than I liked it. I didn't. I didn't. We'll talk about this more in a second. I didn't really care for it. I cared for it even less the second time. But people seem to like it. So maybe maybe it holds well. The other thing is nothing else coming out. Nothing's coming out for like three weeks. So nothing. Nothing. You want to go see a movie?
JVL00:23:38You're going to see Batman. Is this the best? What about opening for a Batman ever?
Sonny00:23:42Oh, no. No, it's not.
JVL00:23:44No. What? What? Which Batman opened?
Sonny00:23:48What bigger dark? I not not not keeping inflation in mind because I don't know inflation. I am not a big fan. Can I just my theory on adjusting for inflation? I don't like adjusting for inflation because whenever you whenever you say like, oh, well, this this is gross this much compared to this. But like, oh, but tickets are so much more expensive. Yeah. You can't see movies in theaters to get air conditioning. OK, I'm not I'm not really worried about what the fucking sound of music did back in the 1960s. Gone with the wind. Gone with the wind. Yeah. It's still in the 1930s. Like we live in different times now. Gone with the Wind didn't have to compete with Fortnite.
Vic00:24:31So you know, wow, I is that John Podhort screaming?
Sonny00:24:35I can almost hear I think I'm just hoping to hear it. I'm hoping to get an angry text message about that tomorrow. No, I am. Let's see. So the Dark Knight and the Dark Knight Rises both did better, I believe. I think I think I think the Dark Knight Rises did. It was close. If I remember correctly, the Dark Knight Rises also happened. There was like a mass shooting. Remember, remember the shooting that happened at the midnight showing of the Dark Knight
Vic00:25:04Rises? I remember you wrote about it. Not the shooting, but you wrote the review. Yes.
Sonny00:25:09In my review, in my review. Well, this is this is a funny, funny story. I wrote my review for the Dark Knight Rises. I think it was the first I think it may have been like the first review I wrote for the Free Beacon because Matt was like, I want Matt Contenetti, our friend Matt Contenetti was like, I want you to review the Dark Knight Rises forces like, OK, I can do that. And the subhead on the review was something like Dark Knight Rises blows audience away. Yeah. Yeah. Bad. Bad. When Bill when Bill Kristol saw that. The next morning in the midst of all the news was like, you guys got to change that. It's like, yeah, you're not wrong. Not wrong. So by the time I was by the time I was awake, it had been changed. The Dark Knight obviously did more Batman for Superman did more Batman for Superman did better.
JVL00:25:57A Batman movie.
Sonny00:25:58Is it? Yes, it is. That's definitely a Batman movie. Man of Steel is a Superman movie. Batman for Superman is a Batman movie because it's all about how the most powerful man in the world would react to a God. It's a honor.
JVL00:26:10It's a Justice League movie.
Sonny00:26:11It's not. No, it's not a Justice League movie. Justice League is a Justice League movie.
Vic00:26:16So this week, obviously, we're discussing the Batman, Batman, the Flitter Mouse.
Sonny00:26:22I'm going to keep saying that I find I find this the the in front of the Batman to be very funny. It has to be.
Vic00:26:28It has to be otherwise sunny. How about a big boy review?
Sonny00:26:35The Batman stars Robert Pattinson as the Batman.
Vic00:26:39And it was directed by Matt Reeves was directed by Matt Reeves. Who is it? Wasn't Kate Mara in one of those Matt Reeves movies? Oh, wow. Oh, oh, there you have to dare again.
JVL00:26:53I think you need to go to Daily Lotion. I don't know. I have no problem with the scene with Juno. I have no problem. Make your monkey jokes.
Vic00:27:00I'm saying I have no problems. I do think she's hot. Okay, go ahead, Sonny.
Sonny00:27:05Sorry, hot monkey. All right. So she. She is not in this movie. Monkey Kate. How dare you?
?00:27:13I just.
Sonny00:27:14I can't even get over this. You've thrown off my whole rundown here. I know.
JVL00:27:17I've thrown you off. Sorry. Sorry.
Sonny00:27:20All right. So the Batman stars Robert Pattinson as Batman. He is in year two. It's a year two story. Not a year one story. Very important to keep in mind.
JVL00:27:31Year two story.
Sonny00:27:32Totally different. Totally different from year one. Year two. Year two story. And as the film opens.
JVL00:27:38I just kept imagining the pitch meeting for that where he goes, oh, we're not going to do Batman. Everybody knows Batman year one. We're going to do Batman year two.
Sonny00:27:50But he's actually more incompetent than Batman in year one. So it's going to be it's going to really confuse people. Movie opens with the brutal murder of the mayor by the Riddler. And Batman is trying to solve who is committing these crimes. The mayor gets killed and then the police chief and then the D.A. There's a terrifying figure wearing an S&M Gimp mask. It's actually not. It's like a winter combat mask or something looks like a mask, but it looks like a Gimp mask. It looks like he's wearing an S&M.
Vic00:28:21Yeah. Who would wear that in the woods? Cold.
Sonny00:28:24We put that back, which I think which I think is I think is intentional and designed to contrast with what the Batman and Catwoman wear. But whatever. Neither here nor there. In the course of all this, trying to solve these crimes. Batman meets up with Selina Kyle, who is a cat burglar. They they team up to try and figure out who is killing people and try. But here's here's my problem with this movie. I got a lot of problems with this movie. Here's here's here's the big one. My big problem with this movie is that the last 40 minutes are totally disconnected from the rest of the picture. So the whole the whole movie is about not really trying to not really trying to solve who. The Riddler is it is it is basically just trying to figure out why he's doing what he's doing or trying to figure out why the Riddler is doing what he's doing, and they finally figure it all out. Oh, it's because Thomas Wayne's renewal fund was being used for illicit purposes by the mob and blah, blah, blah. And then after the Riddler is caught and he's arrested, he essentially gives himself up. Then there is revealed a whole different separate plan that is mentioned nowhere else in the rest of the film. He's going to blow up the sea walls, which are mentioned nowhere else in the rest of the film. Maybe very briefly in like a news clip, he is he's trying to he wants to have a mass shooting of the mayor and all the people who are gathered there to teach them all a lesson about how wicked the city is. It doesn't make it none of none of this stuff makes any sense. None of it is even hinted at. And this is this is the big problem with the movie is that I like for all the talk about how this is a this is a movie where Batman does detective work. This is what all the reviews say. This is a movie where Batman is he's the world's greatest detective. You see him doing all the detecting. He gets led by his dick by the regular through the whole thing. The Riddler basically just tells them all the stuff that's happening. The only the only detecting he does involves him fingering the wrong guy for being the stool pigeon. He goes to the penguin who's played by Colin Farrell, who gives by far my favorite performance in this movie. Colin Farrell as the penguin is a number one performance. In this film with Zoe Kravitz, sexy Catwoman is number two. And Jeffrey Wright's Commissioner Gordon, I guess not Commissioner yet, but Gordon Lieutenant Gordon number three. But the but but he's he's just being he's all the only thing he does to solve these riddles. He solves the riddles. And then it's like, okay, I'm gonna go kill somebody else. Now. Why don't you solve that the riddle after I kill that guy, I, I kind of hate this movie. I kind of hate this after the first the first time I watched it. I didn't love it. But at least I wasn't bored by it. Second time I watched it totally bored. It is paced horribly. It's not it is way too long.
Vic00:31:15It's not Hans Zimmer. Is it who did the score?
Sonny00:31:17No, it's Michael Giacchino, you know, thank you. It does sound good. I actually like the score a lot. That's that's probably my favorite, like filmmaking thing about it. But like, it's so long. It's so long. I a friend described it as a pilot for like the next series of movies. And that's basically what it is. You know, you're setting up the sequel with the Joker, played by Barry Keogh, Keogh, Keogh in the in the in that little last bit there.
Vic00:31:46I'm shaking my head too.
Sonny00:31:48I hate it. I hated I kind of hate this movie. I don't think it's good at all. And I am baffled. I am baffled by the people who are praising it to the heavens it was it was not a successful. It just doesn't work. It doesn't work on like very basic storytelling levels the whole last 40 minutes. The whole big reveal comes out of nowhere. It's totally disconnected from the rest of the movie. It's it's a mess. It's a mess. And like the annoying thing is I'll stop here in a second. I'm sorry. The annoying the most annoying part of all this to me is it I think there is there's a kernel of an idea that they're going for because the movie not only feels too long, it also feels like it's missing scenes and the scenes that it is missing have to do with Batman and social media. And what I mean is this I don't know if you guys notice this, but throughout the film, people are kind of like in the opening minutes, he fights this gang and they say, Who are you? And he says, I'm vengeance. Right. It's like cool line. But then throughout the rest of the movie, people are mockingly calling him vengeance. Like Penguin is like, hey, it's Mr. Vengeance over here. You know, Catwoman calls him vengeance mockingly. And it feels like there's there's like there should have been a scene where like a video of him saying, I'm vengeance to this gang of punks. Right. Goes viral. And like he's he's a he's an inspiration. He's the inspiration of the city. Right. Or he's striking fear into the heart of the city. He's doing he's doing whatever. And that would mirror the scene at the end of the film where, like the Twitch streaming Riddler is gathering his army of four Tran white supremacist bros to go shoot up the place. Right. And like the idea here being, you know, social media is dangerous and using it to create followings has all sorts of ramifications, blah, blah, blah, whatever. Like at least there would have been a nugget of an idea. And that's nowhere. And that's just I'm like reading into what I think was cut out of the hour of stuff that was cut out of this movie. So maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. But it would have been more interesting than what we ended up with. What we ended up with is a mess and doesn't work for me on basically any level.
JVL00:33:51JVL, if you had told the 16 year old me that there was going to be a Batman movie in which bat in which it was super dark. And with an emo Batman and there was even Nirvana Nirvana in the soundtrack.
Vic00:34:13Yeah.
JVL00:34:14Yeah. And then a cat woman who you can kind of almost see her nipples in a couple of scenes. Yes.
Sonny00:34:19Yes.
JVL00:34:20That that that 16 year old me would have been a swing. Yeah. Yeah. And and assuming you hadn't seen the movie seven, I don't I did not like I have I have I did not like for different reasons. And Sonny did not like I can go into them more Victorino. Are we unanimous?
Vic00:34:41Yeah.
JVL00:34:42Do we have a rare bit of unanimity? This is what are you going to swerve? No, no, no. It's yes. I loved it.
Vic00:34:49I wanted another hour. No, I did not like this movie. And I mean, I agree. The music was good. My nephew was texting me and said, the music's really good. And OK, fine. The plot, I gave it a C. So the Riddler is not. It's not the journalist. Who's the journalist? OK, because like, what's all this? This whole thing about the journalist who they covered it up. Well, what does the Riddler have to do with this?
Sonny00:35:16OK, well, no, he's he's not the journalist. But JBL, I did actually have a question on this. I didn't I couldn't I couldn't quite figure it out either time. Was he a colleague of the journalist who was murdered? Was he the forensic accountant or like KTM, whatever?
JVL00:35:29I don't think so.
Sonny00:35:32There's a line there's a line in the film about how one of his one of his identities is as like leads to a is is for a forensic accountant at a at a network or KTML or something like, you know, maybe.
JVL00:35:46I don't know. I just thought he was the orphan who was angry that the Bruce Wayne got like that.
Vic00:35:54Yes. The the the the the orphan who unlike him in the tower, the OK, another question, the didn't the Joker kill? The Wayne's? Isn't that still or is are we now no longer? What do you call it? It's not. We're in a different. What's the term you got?
Sonny00:36:12The Joker never killed the Wayne's not. Well, the joke. Well, the Joker inspired the killing of the Wayne's in the movie.
Vic00:36:18The Joe. And let's not forget about Jack Nick Joker starring Joaquin. And I guess Jack Nicholson did.
JVL00:36:24He did ask them. You ever dance? Jack Nicholson? Did you ever dance with the devil in the pale? Jack Napier?
Vic00:36:29Sure. Very good memory. OK. Also, a question is, is Gotham located near the Arctic Circle where it's like 18 miles and 18 hours of darkness and six hours of light? Is that how it works?
Sonny00:36:40Well, he's a nocturnal. He's a nocturnal. Oh, OK.
JVL00:36:43OK. So things are going on. The darkness in this movie is it made me angry after a while because what Reeves was doing was even making scenes which shouldn't have been dark, dark. Yes. For instance, one of the one of the one of the movie's many climaxes takes place in Madison Square Garden. The the most pure analog of of Gotham to New York City that we've ever seen. And it is an election night watch party for a major mayoral candidate, something that I believe all three of us have been to as reporters in our lives. Except in this version, the election night watch party, everything is dark except for a spotlight on stage. That's not what these things are like these things. The entire arena is lit up because everybody's walking around. And so this was darkness. Darkness for the sake of darkness, and it made it hard to watch after a while. And the rain. Oh, yeah. Super much. The rain is fucking. Is this Godzilla? Yeah. Just that's another way.
Sonny00:37:47Yeah. As a as a one of the filmmaking things that I hated about this was the constant focus pulling like the constantly shifting focus on. I was like, I get it. You know how you know you have a cinematographer by like fucking just keep the camera on something for a while.
Vic00:38:05Please. Yeah. Okay. So a duration is an F. If I could give it to 55.
Sonny00:38:11Well earned.
Vic00:38:12Well earned. Okay. Action and violence. I actually gave it an A. I thought the parts that I saw were pretty entertaining. And the parts that I saw. Did you know? I mean, the parts that I saw. I mean, the part. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Sonny00:38:24Great. It has. Again, like my favorite thing in this movie is Colin Farrell's Penguin and like the car chase. Yeah. Really is just wonderful. Yeah.
JVL00:38:34Incompetently shot. Oh.
Sonny00:38:36But the problem with it, the problem with it is that like you see the ending of it in all of the trailers. Yeah. A hard.
JVL00:38:44Like you know exactly how it's gonna end. Okay. That car chase is one of the more incompetently shot car chases I've seen in a big budget movie. There is no sense of where either the cars are in relation to one another, how they're, why they are, you know, are not run off the road sooner. Uh, nothing about that chase. Hmm. Is successful on screen.
Sonny00:39:07Oh, I, I disagree with that. I thought it worked for me.
Vic00:39:09Uh, and I'd say sex nudity is a D it's not enough because of that scene that JVL mentions. It's a pretty good scene that works. Uh, and then, uh, uh, the overall is about a C minus then. Uh, but like I said, I, I just did not, I, I just didn't find any of it compelling. I, at first I thought, okay, this could be interesting. And then I was like, I just don't care. I just don't care what's happening here. I, you know, so the.
JVL00:39:34The length problem, I hate complaining about things just because of their length, cuz that, that often doesn't seem fair. Yeah. One of the things I, one of the few things I like about the Batman is that it is a very small story. It's a very low stakes story, right? This is essentially a phantom menace kind of thing, right? There is a hidden thing, a hidden power in the city that nobody quite understands and it's, it's unmasking. So we learn the, who the Sith are, right? Oh, they're a Sith. Mm-hmm . It's, it's the phantom menace. And I like that, but the problem is it's a small story and a low stakes tale spread over epic length and none of that is earned, right? You, you do, a film does have to earn its scope to, to one degree or another. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If you're gonna be that long. And the number of throwaway moments. The opening. I cannot believe that a three hour movie trying to reboot the single most important piece of intellectual property that Warner Brothers owns. Mm-hmm . Begins with a long shot, which goes on for like 90 seconds of somebody looking through binoculars. Yes. In an apartment building. Yeah. Up and down and around and death with characters who we never really meet. Right. Or spend any time with and who don't matter. Mm-hmm . Like what, who does that? Who does that? And that's the other thing, this, it is this small story and yet the movie is packed with extraneous characters, Oswald Cobblepot, the Colin Farrell character. There is no reason for him to be in this movie. Uh, there is no reason, no earthly reason at all for Selena Kyle to be in this movie.
Sonny00:41:31Mm-hmm .
JVL00:41:32The only. The only three characters we need are, are, uh, well, Moroni is off screen, right? So we need Falcone. We need the Riddler. We need the Batman. That's it. This is a story about those three people. We don't need anything. And all the other stuff, the, the, the, the penguin and Catwoman is only here because it feels like somebody said, no, it has to be a superhero movie.
Sonny00:41:58No, no, see the penguin stuff works because the penguin is like fully is wholly in service of the plot. And like, and, and even, even getting to the red herring, well, he's just a, he's just a gangster. He's just a fence. He's just a, you know, he's just running, he's basically running day-to-day operations for the mob and you need, you need the mobster who gets pissed off that Falcone is the, is the rat for that to land at the end. The Catwoman character is the one that is totally extraneous. All this stuff with her and her Russian girlfriend, like get cut, cut all that shit out of them. And her mom cut that shit out of the movie.
Vic00:42:36Cut it all out. I don't even remember the part about the mom, the, uh, but our father, of course. All right.
Sonny00:42:42Let me ask you. Well, but that, but no, but her mom, her, her mom is like, is like that, that all the stuff with her family relation to Falcone, get rid of it, all of it useless.
Vic00:42:52And she has all these, I mean, she's really good at fighting, but we don't get into sort of why or how she's.
JVL00:42:56The central story tension is about Thomas Wayne and his relationship with Falcone. And yet that is given like B or C level attention within, within the story as it's told. Right. You know, you get this one, honestly, the, the best scene in the movie is when, uh, Falcone played by John Turturro, who I think is miscast in this. It's the first time I've ever not really liked John Turturro on screen. I liked him in this just because, but where he, he meets with Bruce Wayne and shows a very different side of what we expect of him, where he is explained to Bruce. That, you know, his father was a good guy and yes, he went and killed this dude on his father's behalf, but you know, and in order for, for the story to really land, you need to lean into the idea that Falcone is not as bad as we all think he is. And yet there's almost no effort given to that, right? Cuz the twist, the twist of the end is that Falcone is, is the Phantom menace, right? He's he's Palpatine, he's the one behind everything and they just spend almost no time selling him as like, not as bad as you think, which is what is important. I, again, I, I just think this movie should have been an hour 50. It should have, you could have, should have lost many of the characters. As you said. Yeah. I mean, the movie should end with the Riddler being arrested, right? This is the, the end of the movie should be the, the Riddler thinking that he and Batman have been working together and that Batman views him as a, as a partner and him going crazy. And it turns out the Batman doesn't like him. Like that should be the end of the movie.
Vic00:44:36That would have been, that would have been great thing.
JVL00:44:37And him banging on the, uh, the, the glass yelling, so they, they call these sea walls. Sea walls would not be what, what happens. This is the idea that we're going to flood all of Gotham only happens if you're in New
Sonny00:44:50Orleans and you're breaking the levies.
JVL00:44:52Yeah. The levies. So you blow up the levies. We're going to blow up the levies because the entire city is built below sea level. That's fine. It's just, it's okay.
Sonny00:44:59It's idiotic. Yeah. Well, the, the, yeah. The other, uh, like the other, the other weird thing about this movie is that it, it wears its influences very much on its sleeve. Right. This is very much seven. It's very much David Fincher seven or the voiceover at the beginning gives off real taxi driver vibes or like if you want to stay in the comic book world, it gives off Rorschach vibes. Yeah.
JVL00:45:23Again, things that if you told me at 16, we're going to be in a Batman movie. I would have been. Right.
Sonny00:45:28Sounds, sounds awesome. This is amazing.
Vic00:45:30If you haven't seen any of this stuff.
Sonny00:45:32Wow. Thank you. That was almost a 3d. But, but instead of, instead of leaning into that at the end, the movie totally blinks from it and says, uh, actually Batman can still save everybody. It's fine. Like if you would, if you had ended the movie in the prison with the, the Riddler saying, Oh, you're not as smart as I think. And then like Madison square garden blows up and collapses and kills everybody inside. Right. Like that would have been the seven or taxi driver.
Vic00:46:00That would have been like a real rain.
Sonny00:46:02Real rain is going to come and clean these streets. And sure enough, he does it like, and Batman couldn't stop it because he's too fucking dumb. Cause he is like, he is actually a he's done very smart. Batman. No, he's fair.
Vic00:46:15He does collect the greeting cards. He's getting the greeting cards.
Sonny00:46:18There's more detective work in that magical bullet recreation scene in the dark night than there is in this entire movie. All right.
Vic00:46:28Let me ask you, was it necessary for Colin? Farrell to be cast in a, in a fat suit, could they not have gotten a heavy actor to play this role? Was that necessary? I kept them staring at him and thinking I was reminded of two things. I was reminded of, uh, is it, you know, uh, Tom Hart, Tom Hardy, right? Tom Hardy. Tom Hardy. And, uh, Al remember he did the awful Al Capone movie we saw Capone awful reminded me of him. It also reminded me of Al Pacino as big boy, Caprice and Dick Tracy, you know, just a little hard, you know?
Sonny00:47:00I, I, I. It was cartoonish. It was cartoonish. I disagree with, I disagree with everything that you guys are saying about the penguin in this. It was very cartoonish. I thought it was the only thing that worked in this, because he is cartoonish.
JVL00:47:08The least, the least, the, the worst work I've ever seen Colin Farrell do on screen is the, the worst performance. And this guy, I love him. Yeah. I love him all the time. Great actor. I love him in everything.
Sonny00:47:20Mm-hmm. You guys are wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong.
JVL00:47:23All right.
Vic00:47:24Well, go ahead.
JVL00:47:25I, you know, I, I gotta say the other thing is this is a Batman movie bereft of ideas. Like. There's no ideas in it and the story isn't great there. It's not play. It's not even trying to play with any big ideas and maybe this is just, we're spoiled by Christopher Nolan. Yes. But even to the extent of, you know, like the Joker is a movie of ideas. Birds of prey is a movie of ideas. Uh, even Batman versus Superman and man of steel are, as Sonny will be quick to tell us there. They have an idea at the center of the movies. This doesn't have anything. This is just like big ideas.
Sonny00:47:59It's just there. No, see, I think, I, I think you're actually wrong on this. I think you're wrong on this. This is a movie with the idea that Batman makes the world the worst place it is. It is a movie that has internalized all of the like contrarian takes about Batman that like instead of beating up the mentally ill, he should put his money into, uh, helping people with philanthropy. Right. Or like it, you know, he inspires more crime than he solves. It's a movie. It's he needs to confront his white privilege.
Vic00:48:25I love that line.
Sonny00:48:26I love that.
JVL00:48:27I think you're reading your own things into this.
Sonny00:48:31White privilege. Oh, it's literally the text of the film.
JVL00:48:34It's not even the idea that Batman is making things worse. Oh, I, I don't think the movie thinks that it says it, it's again, it says it in the
Sonny00:48:41text of the film. He, he's talking about how the crime has gone up over the last two years. He says, am I making things worse? And the answer is yes, it's the, it's not the subtext. It's the thing above the subtext. It's the text of the movie.
JVL00:48:56But yet he says everything. And this is what, again, it may have that. But it does not have the courage of its convictions to actually go there.
Sonny00:49:03I agree. I agree that it does not. I, again, this movie would be so much better if everybody just died at the end of it. I would have more respect for it if like everybody got blown up.
Vic00:49:11What did you think of Paul Dano as the Riddler?
Sonny00:49:14Oh, you mean the Joker? Heath Ledger's Joker? It is.
JVL00:49:18That's exactly what it is. It's a weird. So if we just say it's a different villain, then people won't realize it.
Sonny00:49:26I mean like beat to beat, it's the same. Yeah.
Vic00:49:29He looks by the way. He also looks like he hasn't aged. He looks like he just got out of doing Little Miss Sunshine. And here he is doing the Riddler.
Sonny00:49:37He really is like an ageless one.
Vic00:49:39Yeah. It's amazing. It's very strange. But also when he puts on the Riddler outfit, yes, he's very cerebral, but he seemed to be much more powerful physically, I thought, when he's as the Riddler.
JVL00:49:50Well, that's because that's his real self, right?
Sonny00:49:51When he puts his mask on, you can see who he really is. That's true. Yeah.
Vic00:49:56That's true. That's true. Just like the Batman. I did like Jeffrey Wright. Because Jeffrey Wright is just a very good actor. He's not given anything to do. No. The other night, the other case in point, last night, I think it was last night, I rewatched the French Dispatch because Kate had never seen it and loved it. What a sacrifice. That's the reason why. What a sacrifice. You wanted to introduce her to the surprise. For no reason. You're a good husband. You're a good, good husband, Victorino. It's very artistic and tasteful. It's tasteful. The movie as a whole is very tasteful. But he's fantastic in that. He's fantastic, obviously. But Jeffrey Wright is really, really good in that role.
Sonny00:50:34I love the way Jeffrey Wright calls Batman, man.
?00:50:38He does?
Sonny00:50:39You got to get it together, man.
JVL00:50:42Yeah. Now, you know, the whole time I actually thought to myself, this feels like a movie, the central plot of which is stolen from a Godfather line, Moroni never could have fought Thomas. I should have known it was... Falcone the whole time. All along.
Vic00:51:02I should have known it was Falcone all along. By the way, I kept on waiting for Eric Roberts to make a cameo appearance.
JVL00:51:08Yeah. And you know what? The funny thing is I liked Pattinson as Batman, but not as... Bruce Wayne. Not as Bruce Wayne. I don't understand it. And I think it's the first big DC misfire in a while, because again, I love Peacemaker. I think Peacemaker is great. I liked the suit. The Suicide Squad, or was it Suicide Squad?
Sonny00:51:33You really liked... That one was...
JVL00:51:35Whatever the second one was, I liked it.
Sonny00:51:37Yeah.
JVL00:51:38I think that one was The Suicide Squad. If you put it The, it's a new movie.
Sonny00:51:41And you like Birds of Prey a lot.
JVL00:51:42I did. For me, DC has been on a real hot streak, and this is just... I didn't...
Sonny00:51:51I think it fails on a very basic storytelling level. It's not a well-told or competently told story.
JVL00:51:58No, it really isn't. It really isn't. Are there stingers? I did not stay. I ran out of the theater.
Sonny00:52:05Neither did I. Neither did I. Tell us. There's one all the way at the end, if you stick around all the way to the end. They show the URL, the Radha Alata, and with a little question. If you go there, there's a virtual game thing. Answer riddles. What?
Vic00:52:24That's it? On your phone? Yeah.
Sonny00:52:27You go to RadhaAlata.com. Yeah. RadhaAlata.com.
Vic00:52:30This is like the Super Bowl ad giving- RadhaAlata. Whatever the-
JVL00:52:34I got to say, the end of the film where we have the Riddler and the Joker becoming cellmate buddies, not cell, I guess they were adjacent cells, that felt to me a lot like an Injustice League with Jesse Eisenberg, and I guess it's the Terminator who shows up. I just thought, does somebody, whoever's running creative control over there, the Terminator is Deathstroke, they're the same character, does somebody doing- Deadshot. No. No, that's a different character. Does somebody who's doing- Deadpool. I have no idea what you're talking about. What I'm saying is, does somebody think that these endings are good for the movies? Does somebody think that's an ending-
Sonny00:53:23Yeah, of course, because it's a shared universe, doing a shared universe.
Vic00:53:27People are so conditioned now to say, "Oh, there's going to be good stingers." And lately, including Marvel, there's been some real dud stingers, like, "I waited to see a million credits," and it's like, "Oh."
Sonny00:53:38Well, so interesting, so there-
JVL00:53:41This has more endings than Return of the King.
Sonny00:53:44It has as many endings as Batman Begins. I rewatched Batman Begins recently, and that movie has three endings as well. And it's the same kind of three endings, like splitting up with the girl, villains, whatever. But the-
JVL00:54:00Do they ride together on motorcycles for 30 seconds before they split up?
Sonny00:54:03Oh, God, that shot goes on forever. That shot goes- You complained about the shot at the beginning, but I didn't have a problem with that. That's building tension. I don't mind that. I don't mind that. But that shot at the end where they drive through 17 cemeteries-
JVL00:54:17We're driving through another cemetery. We're just going to drive through- We're going to drive some more.
Sonny00:54:22It's like the runway at the end of that Fast and Furious movie, Fast and Furious 6 or whatever, 27 miles long. No, so the first cut of this movie, I think, was something like four hours long. Oh, my goodness. And supposedly, originally, there was a scene where the Joker, Batman shows up and interrogates the Joker like he is essentially Hannibal in Manhunter. And so that scene at the end would have made more sense. Yeah, it's dead. Instead, it's just tacked on because why not? Why not just have Batman? Why not just have Joker? Why not just have Joker show up?
JVL00:54:59And who plays? So this is Barry Keoghan. Keoghan.
Sonny00:55:02He's remember? Oh, yeah.
JVL00:55:04Yeah.
Sonny00:55:05He's the Irish guy with the weird face thing going on. Yeah.
Vic00:55:09Also, Chernobyl is friggin in Dunkirk. He was in.
Sonny00:55:11He was in Dunkirk.
Vic00:55:12I like him.
Sonny00:55:13I like him. I actually like him. I like him. I think he's a good actor. That's weird. That's weird.
Vic00:55:19He's a good actor. Because in the beginning, you see the Joker masks for all that date back to the Joaquin Phoenix Joker.
JVL00:55:23And I'm sorry, one more thing that the extent to which this is. Is derivative of Dark Knight. Is offensive. Yes. Because it's it's derivative without being aspirational, right? It's not aspiring to be of the same caliber or something. It's just and there is no scene more derivative than when we get the Batman interrogating the Riddler. Yes. Just like the Joker. But they're not in the same room, so we can't actually hit him. And so they feel like he just pounds on the glass. Yes.
Vic00:55:59I just thought, what the fuck?
Sonny00:56:00How many times do we have to see this in different ways? What have you done? What have you done? Yeah, we've seen this before. Again, the character is just Heath Ledger's Joker. It's like it actually like I don't know, I like I would think they would be kind of ashamed to make a character that that that's so obviously the same. I like no, I got I've I've talked about this movie a lot now. I've talked I talked about it on across the movie aisle. I've talked about it with you guys. I've talked about it with a bunch of different friends like over text message and I hate it more than just about anybody except maybe Jamie. I'm glad to be finally amongst people who share my my distaste for this movie because
JVL00:56:39it is film.
Sonny00:56:40Twitter that likes kids and 86% fresh on Rotten Tomatoes 93% audience fresh. It's getting people love it.
Vic00:56:49People it's you know, yeah, this is the rare movie where all three of us were like this was terrible.
JVL00:56:54So I don't understand how people could like both Spider-Man. No, way. And then this and this one of them is a well made movie. One of them is not.
Vic00:57:03Oh, yeah. But you know, this is so dark. People are the worst.
JVL00:57:06I like dark. It has Nirvana in it. I was there. He reads from his his journal. He practically says, you know, mood music, the Postal Service, right?
Vic00:57:16I mean, this is how emo he is, right?
Sonny00:57:19Right. He is. He's very evil.
JVL00:57:22He looks he's literally wearing eye shadow. I don't know. Because of the mask. And he just is about to wash it off. And just the hair.
Vic00:57:27The hair.
Sonny00:57:28The hair. Yeah. And again, the hair in his eyes.
JVL00:57:33Sixteen year old me is down for that. Sixteen year old me there. Yeah.
Sonny00:57:37That's the difference. I think. And you're right. He's good. He plays a good Batman. It's just the Bruce Wayne does not work really at all. We haven't even talked about Andy Serkis. Oh, yeah.
JVL00:57:46What did you think about him? Really? I let me tell you this. I like Andy Serkis. I was fucking offended that he wasn't dead. Oh, you didn't like again. What's the point?
Vic00:57:56What's the point?
JVL00:57:57Of having an explosion to raise the stakes if the character is then just like in a little light coma. And then he's got to be in the next one.
Vic00:58:06By the way, how is it that Batman's face was not damaged when Peter Sarsgaard blew up? You know how close he was?
Sonny00:58:16Peter Sarsgaard is good in this movie. Yes.
Vic00:58:18I like Peter Sarsgaard. Peter Sarsgaard plays it perfectly. And it's a small role, but he does very well. I love Peter Sarsgaard is very good. And also as Charles Lane. Chuck Lane. Chuck Lane in Shattered Glass.
Sonny00:58:29It's funny. I just rewatched Mr. Jones, which is about the Ukrainian famine and Walter Durant. He plays Walter Duranty. Oh, really? In it. And he plays Walter Duranty as like a total degenerate, like a crippled sex addict, drug addict. It's amazing. It's the most right wing thing I've ever seen in a movie of this sort. But it's just very funny that he has played both like the fabulously scrupulous Chuck Lane. Yes. He's destroying his own career to like uncover the misdeeds by his reporters and also Walter Duranty. Yeah.
JVL00:59:04You know. Is he related to Stellan? Genuinely a drug addict. Yeah.
Sonny00:59:08Yeah.
JVL00:59:09Hmm?
Vic00:59:10Is he related to Stellan?
Sonny00:59:11No.
Vic00:59:12I don't. What about the other Sarsgaard? Because he's Sarsgaard and they are Sarsgaard.
Sonny00:59:15There's Stellan Sarsgaard. Yeah. And then there's Bill Sarsgaard. Right. And Peter Sarsgaard. That's right.
JVL00:59:21Because one of the sons plays Pennywise. Which is the one that used to be on the Showtime vampire series.
Sonny00:59:27That was HBO. That was True Blood. True Blood. That's Alexander Sarsgaard, I believe. Okay.
Vic00:59:32Is he related to any of them? Yeah. I think. Yes.
Sonny00:59:36They're the sons of Stellan. And then it, Pennywise. Yes. Was the other Sarsgaard. Yes. And then there's Stellan Sarsgaard. And then there's Peter Sarsgaard. And so Peter Sarsgaard. Unrelated. No. Peter Sarsgaard. Yeah. Sars.
JVL00:59:49We've reached like that Ted Leo Ted Lasso moment where the sounds are not making words to me anymore.
?00:59:57Okay.
JVL00:59:58All right. Do we. Do we.
Vic01:00:01Spirit of the week corrections shout outs.
Sonny01:00:02Three thumbs down. Yeah. Yeah. I can't believe. No. We need. We are on a lonely island out here, folks. Yeah. That's something.
Vic01:00:11People are going to yell at us in the comments. Tell us how good this movie was. No. There was a fair amount of people in my theater. I assume yours as well.
JVL01:00:16Can I throw a little funny thing? So I, in my newsletter today, I ran as a section header the word cold bringer. And just threw a little footnote in saying, you know, a cookie for whoever, whoever knows what that is. I was shocked at the number of people who were like, oh, that's the name of the missile in Frank Miller's Dark Knight Rises.
?01:00:41Oh.
Vic01:00:42I wouldn't have gotten that. I didn't. I did not get it either.
JVL01:00:47This stuff. I was like. This stuff. The Batman is a major cultural presence. That's all.
Sonny01:00:52Okay. I have one. I have one thing. Hold on. Yes. Hold on. We got a, we got a birthday shout out. Ooh. Uh, we got a, uh, birthday shout out, uh, to David, uh, I'm going to, I'm going to butcher this, but David Abrametto, Abrametto, I don't know, uh, wife, Samantha signed up for the podcast to send me this message. Oh, so happy birthday, David, uh, his birthday was on Monday, March 7th, but obviously we got, we, we, we didn't get the message.
JVL01:01:22Hey, can I, can I, a very elliptical shout out because I don't want to betray. Any, any privacy issues, but, uh, I, I shared it with you guys and a friend of the show had a wonderful life event, uh, and had, uh, had a baby and I don't want to say any more than that, except that when they, uh, when they listened to this, uh, we're thinking of you and couldn't be happier, overjoyed, overjoyed.
Vic01:01:48That is all the time we're given to this episode, questions, comments, compliments, tweet us at Sonny Bunch at Victorino Mattis again, be sure to subscribe to us on Patreon. Just go to subbeacon.com we are there, tell your friends until next time. So, uh, if you have something I, I defer to you.
JVL01:02:14I, you know, I'm just going to say that I, I really hated Zoe Kravitz as Selena Kyle too.
?01:02:19Yeah.
Vic01:02:20She, well, she, you know, it's interesting, I can't believe that she is, she's the daughter of Lenny Kravitz. Um, I didn't realize that Lenny Kravitz is old, but I guess that means we're old. Yeah. Like isn't he, isn't he in his twenties like us? Oh, wait a minute. We're not. Okay. So here, so, you know, knowing that this movie was going to be like three hours long and I went to. Did you, did you do run pee? Uh, no, I didn't have strangely, strangely something happened to my kidneys and I, I didn't move. There was a mess in the chair when I was over, I have no idea how that happened. It was no, but, uh, but I knew, so it was like 4:30, which meant. By the way, no, it was 4:40, which means it did not start until five Oh five. Right. And it's going to go on until like eight o'clock. So I'm like, it's right in the middle of dinner. So I had leftovers that from the night before it, Jonathan's putting his hand on his head. He doesn't even want to know how this ends.
JVL01:03:17Uh, I had, you brought them into the theater with you.
Vic01:03:19Didn't you? I did in aluminum foil and like, like, like that, like that giant friend of ours that we talk about with the backpack and the aluminum foil in the back. And it was so, I didn't think it would, I forgot how loud aluminum foil is.
Sonny01:03:33And I just waited for the club seats to take it out.
Vic01:03:37And it was because the weather was so warm, if not now it's cold again, but it was warm. So I had grilled some sausages on the grill. So I took out these sausages and I just hope no one saw the silhouette of me with the, you know, just going back and forth.
JVL01:03:53I'm sure it's fine. - Bye.
Spot something wrong in this episode? Suggest a correction →
Comments
Loading…