#49. 'LuLaRich' (Prime Video)
Listen to this episode ↗on Substack, where the show lives now
The main event is LuLaRich, Amazon Prime's four-part documentary on the rise and fall of the LuLaRoe multi-level-marketing legging empire, and it splits the hosts: Sonny, after a lengthy satirical bit casting the film as media persecution of hardworking Mormon entrepreneurs, settles into a genuine defense that LuLaRoe made a real product people wanted and that its collapse is more a story of failing to scale than outright fraud, putting it a notch above the WeWork/Fyre Festival/Theranos documentary triptych it completes. JVL flatly disagrees, calling LuLaRich the strongest of what he dubs the "quad documentary" and pointing to the film's deft intercutting of deposition footage — especially a family member caught denying he ever called the company a pyramid scheme, immediately smash-cut to video of him doing exactly that — as proof the 2017 overhaul of the bonus structure was a deliberate attempt to get ahead of looming lawsuits, not an innocent pivot. Vic, who says he'd never even heard of LuLaRoe before watching, digs into the cast of characters (Roberta Blevins, Lacy, the Case Western professor, and especially the eminently punchable "weed guy" nephew) and joins Sonny in finding journalist Jill Filipovich the most insufferable talking head in the film, while the trio also picks apart the cheap Vestal-brand "watch" given as a status reward and Deanna's suspicious Tijuana gastric-sleeve surgery. Before any of that, the episode opens with an extended, increasingly unhinged JVL monologue about house-hunting in New Jersey and his terror of septic tanks after a friend's system backed up "shit and toilet paper" onto his deck — "the telltale poop" — followed by Vic reporting his gout is in remission (though a mild cold has set in) and a lengthy dissection of a viral video of a visibly drunk Nicolas Cage being walked barefoot out of a restaurant in broad daylight. Box office chat covers Shang-Chi's continued lead, an oddly strong second-place debut for Dear Evan Hansen, and the eternal presence of Free Guy in the top three, with teases for upcoming reviews of Many Saints of Newark and Venom.
From the show notes
This week, JVL is a septic skeptic. Vic can relate to Nicolas Cage. And the guys discuss LuLaRich . Is it a pyramid scheme? Or something better?
Full transcript
Sonny00:00:00- LuLaRoe. - LuLaRoe. - What in the hell? LuLaRoe, what is that?
Guest00:00:03- We are creating confidence and security. - I had achieved the dream. I was selling magic leggings.
Sonny00:00:11- This is a huge opportunity in America. - Women were selling breast milk so they could afford startup costs.
Guest00:00:17- It had just become a circus. - Woohoo! - Mark starts spouting off passages from the Book of Mormon.
Sonny00:00:23- A mass delusion. - Oh my God, I'm in a cult. - Did any of them have a clue how to run a company of this size? - No.
Vic00:00:42- Hello and welcome to another edition of The Sub-Beacon. I'm Victor Matus, along with Jonathan V. Last and Sonny Bunch. Just a reminder, The Sub-Beacon is now available through Patreon. Go to subbeacon.com, you'll easily find us. Please subscribe, tell your friends, and don't forget about The Sub-Beacon merchandise store at tpublic.com. And by the way, thank you, Sonny, for sending us that big, fat check. I already spent mine. - Merry Christmas.
Sonny00:01:09- Thank you. - Merry Christmas to Kate and the kids.
Vic00:01:11- Thank you. I spent mine on a chopped salad, one of the cheaper ones.
Sonny00:01:16- Not a full one.
Vic00:01:18- Oh, no. I believe it was--
Sonny00:01:19- Like Caesar without chicken.
Vic00:01:21- Without the chicken. Right, the kale Caesar. No, so I went to get, I wanted to get their Asian chicken salad, right? And it's gone. It's now called the ginger sesame salad. Why did they do that?
Sonny00:01:36- They got rid of the Asian?
Vic00:01:38- They did.
Sonny00:01:39- I mean, I remember back in the day when it was called the Oriental.
Vic00:01:42- Yeah, that's the only, that's the one I want. I love that one. I love that one.
Sonny00:01:46- The Oriental Mandarin. - Yes, yes. - It's like, whoa. And then they changed it 'cause they're a bunch of PC losers.
Vic00:01:51- Yes, with yellow tomatoes.
Sonny00:01:52- Changed it to Asian chicken. Now it's gingers. - Oh, it's terrible. - How am I supposed to know what it tastes like when you have names like ginger? - Ginger chicken salad.
Vic00:02:00- That's right, that's right.
JVL00:02:01I want to know what's Chinese. - Victorino, if I were to go to amazon.com right now and search for the D&D manual Oriental Adventures. - Oh, yes!
Vic00:02:10- Do you think it is still sold under that title? - Oh, man. You know what? It would be the one, it would, underused. Underused Oriental Adventures. - Or do you think they've re--
JVL00:02:19- Oh, that was good. - Renamed it. - That was good stuff. 'Cause you could basically, you could make a character who is essentially the D&D version of Storm Shadow.
Vic00:02:27- Yes, yes, you could because I believe that's where I learned the term Shuriken, Shuriken, phew.
JVL00:02:33The Chinese star. - Good pronunciation.
Vic00:02:35- Thank you, how exciting that was. Wow, that's a blast from the past. You know, there was also another version. Do you ever play the spy version of that? I forget what they call it and our listeners are gonna be screaming and it was like, it was an espionage, it was like a spy adventure version. Also from TSR.
Mike00:02:53- Never had it. - Oh my gosh, like fleetingly, I think my sister got it.
Vic00:02:58It was very cool. Very cool. What's going on with you JVL? - So we got a problem. - What is the problem?
JVL00:03:07- So as you boys know, we are going to be moving back to the homeland.
Vic00:03:15- This is real. - Going back to the jurors. - This is real and this is official. Now people are knowing this. I didn't say anything to anybody.
JVL00:03:21- So unclear when, the idea is to do it next spring/summer. Spring's coming, spring/summer '22. - But my wife was up in the jurors this weekend and I was down here with the boys doing things like letting them have chocolate chip cookies for breakfast and watch Wrestlemania before going to school.
Vic00:03:46- Sure, as one does. - The TV, even I draw the line, that's forbidden. TV before school? - Not just TV. - Wrestlemania, getting them all riled up. Getting them all riled up.
Sonny00:03:58- Did you turn on a classic? - Did you turn on a classic Wrestlemania? Did you turn on like the WWE app and find a-
JVL00:04:04- Well, the WWE app is no more. That's been swallowed by Peacock. But you can just like, we just ducked into Peacock and just pulled a Wrestlemania at random, wow. - Which one? - I don't remember 'cause we watched like five different Wrestlemanias over the course of this four day little room springing. Anyway, unimportant, unimportant. What's important is that in, you know, a cheese cone curd sheets, cheese curd, induced state of euphoria. I sent Shannon a listing on the Zillow for a house that I, because I'm always looking, always looking. - Oh, sure. - And she is very anti me looking. She's like, why are you looking? We're not gonna move till next spring or summer, but it just, don't, don't bother. Anyway, and she kind of lost her mind and fell in love with this place. And she went and toured it and is really into it. And I may drive up to go take a look. - This is the house you showed us. - In a day or two.
Sonny00:05:05- How long has it been on Zillow?
JVL00:05:08- 21 days. Look, unimportant.
Sonny00:05:09- Okay, you've got some time.
JVL00:05:10- Unimportant. - Some time. - Here's what's important. This house, while perfect in many ways, is not on public sewer. - Oh, it's the septic. Yeah, yeah, the tank. - It's on a septic system. - Yes. - Now I am a little bit nervous about septic systems. And I reached out to my best friend, Chris, about this this morning. Said, you know, I sent him the listing and we were talking about pros and cons. And I said, so what do you think about septic? And Chris's response to me was, ah, septic is no problem. Septics are fine. He says, he bought a house out on Long Island, a little sort of like, you know, weekend getaway place. - Oh my gosh. - About 18 months ago in Matatuck. And he says, you know, we have septic out here. And it's only giving us problems once. And all that happened was it got, it got a little backed up. And so, so, you know, a bunch of liquid, which is mostly just chemically treated urine backed up and came out of the overflow overflow valve. And, and then some, some like, you know, soggy used toilet paper was, was part of that. And then, you know, just like a little bit of shit and all this stuff just sort of like, you know, pulled out on the deck.
Vic00:06:28- It comes up, it comes up from underneath. This is like, yes.
JVL00:06:32- But it's, but, but it was no big deal. And, and so septics are fine. So, and I'm sitting there and I'm like, so this is not like he's had this place for 35 years and it's only backed up and he's had shit and toilet paper and chemically treated urine on his deck once. It's that already this has happened after like 18 months. And, and when the septic goes wrong, when it goes wrong, the result is you get shit on your deck.
Vic00:06:56- Okay. How does it get on? Like explain how it gets on the deck. It can't be too high above the ground. - I mean, it depends on where your thing is, right? - Exactly. But I mean, what is underneath it then? Is it like grass? Is it like, because then I guess your grass is being automatically treated with a very natural fertilizer, I guess you could say, but you wouldn't want to treat it.
JVL00:07:16Yeah. Night soil, light soil. Here's your watermelon. - I, but, but so could I live in a place? - You? - Knowing where, where I am one flush away from this happening at any moment, knowing that, that the poop is right there underneath me at all times.
Sonny00:07:40- That could be the Taj Mahal. You could be, you could be, you could be trying to buy a literal palace in the French countryside with a Butler who'd be bringing you croissants and Brie every morning.
JVL00:07:54- It's like the telltale fucking heart.
Sonny00:07:56- If it had the poop, the poop problem, why would you want that?
JVL00:07:59- The telltale poop. It's right. It is literally lurking, waiting at any minute to do this. Leave aside the fact that septic means you can't have a garbage disposal and I'm sorry. I thought I was a civilized human being and civilized human beings use garbage disposals. I don't like peel my, my food scraps out of the sink by hand to put them into my compost caddy. That's not what I do.
Sonny00:08:23- Question.
JVL00:08:24- You're combining a lot in there.
Vic00:08:25There's a lot going on, but Sonny.
Sonny00:08:28Uh, is much of New Jersey, um, uh, a, uh, uh, savage land like this. - No, no, no, no, no. - I feel like New Jersey is a place that has a lot of sewer lines for the most part.
Vic00:08:43- Oh, sure, sure.
Sonny00:08:44- It is. - Are you, is this house in the Pine Barrens? - No. - Is there a Russian running around?
JVL00:08:49- Good call Sonny, the Pine Barrens. - It is up the, up the hill from Boonton, looking at Boonton. And so it is, or as I, I call it Boonton.
Vic00:08:58- None of, none of. - Boonton. - Boonton like Tretton.
Sonny00:09:01- Boonton. - Tretton. - Boonton. - Is it, is it near, is it near the highway? 'Cause that's the only thing I've ever been. That's the only place I've ever been in Atlantic City. Here's where I've been in Atlantic City. I've been through Atlantic City to get to New York City, which is where people have, uh, non-septic tank bathrooms. Um, and I've, I've, uh, been, I've been out, uh, I've been, I've been out to Atlantic City. So I've been, I've been through New Jersey to New York City. I've been out to Atlantic City. That's it. That's, those are the only things I understand about, those are the only directions I understand.
Vic00:09:31- This is really, this is really a conversation for like, a couple episodes from now when we do Many Saints of Newark, but, uh, uh, in any event, no.
Sonny00:09:38- Do that next week, that's next week.
Vic00:09:39- Is that next week? - Comes out on Friday. - I thought you wanted to do Venom, but we can talk about that later. Venom.
Sonny00:09:46- Do we, do we wanna do Venom?
Vic00:09:47- Not really, I'm happy to do Many Saints. Uh, I didn't know they were coming out at the same time. Uh, so anyway, no, uh.
JVL00:09:52- Let There Be Carnage might as well be the title of what happens when your septic tank backs up.
Vic00:09:57- Yeah. - This is like every flush, you know?
JVL00:09:59- That's a red one.
Vic00:10:00- So how does this, why would there be a problem? Is it because it's like an overflow, a lid? The lid to the tank comes off and it's a pipe?
JVL00:10:07- I got a five year old in this house who craps the size of a baseball bat once a month. I mean, I don't know if you guys remember this, like he broke a plunger on me. I had to go out and buy the sophisticated high tech. Gee, money could wreck a septic system any given day. Can I live like that? - No.
Vic00:10:27- Well, I don't know the answer. - I don't know the answer.
Sonny00:10:29- Thousands of people have plumbing thoughts for you. - How much would it cost to actually get connected to the city sewer lines? Have you looked into this?
JVL00:10:37- I don't think this is the type of, I mean, it's New Jersey. So the bribe I would have to pay to the guy at the city manager's office would probably be like three million to start.
Sonny00:10:46- No, no, but like those guys are cheap. It's like 10 grand.
Vic00:10:48- Yeah, yeah. You know what though? I think a lot of people have septic tanks out there, JVL.
Sonny00:10:55- You just gotta kill one other guy.
Vic00:10:57And not everybody has problems. They just have the occasional problem. You just don't know when. - That's the problem. It's always there.
JVL00:11:05How could you sleep at night knowing that you might wake up to a bunch of poop on your deck?
Sonny00:11:11A poop deck! - What if you wake up?
JVL00:11:13- Literally a poop deck.
Sonny00:11:15- What if you wake up and you have to go poop? And then you go poop and then you hear the poop splashing onto the deck.
Vic00:11:19- Surprise, surprise. Skip the whole process, just go right on the deck. Sonny, what's going on with you?
Sonny00:11:27- Not much compared to all of that.
JVL00:11:31- No one's gonna top that.
Sonny00:11:32- Mm-mm. - JBL's crowning moment. - I don't, oh, gross. I have nothing. I have nothing after that. You can skip me, come back to me, I gotta think. My mind has been blown by the poop deck.
Vic00:11:46- Yeah, well, so to speak. People have been asking about the gout and I am, I'm in remission, as we say. I'm in remission. And the lump is still there, but it's not a problem anymore. There's no pain, it's shrinking, which is good news. And I'm back to my old ways. Although I have yet to drink, which means it has been several days since I've had a drink. Maybe a week. Could it have been a week since I had alcohol? That's crazy. - Are you twitching? - No. - Do you have the TTs? - I mean, you have the cold sweats, but everyone does, right? I mean, that's normal.
Sonny00:12:20- Everyone has that all the time.
Vic00:12:21- I was gonna say, yes, I'm not quite ready to get back on the, shall we say, the Nick Cage bandwagon. Sonny, you saw that video, JVL, have you seen the video?
Sonny00:12:31- It's amazing.
Vic00:12:32- Nick Cage, Sonny, explain this video.
Sonny00:12:34- So Nick Cage is just, just shit-faced drunk. He is, he is, blitz. It's leaving Las Vegas, but real life. And he's in, he's in a, he's in a, he's in a, he's in a restaurant, like on a couch.
Vic00:12:47- I wanna know which restaurant. It looked just so-so, you know? It looked just so-so.
Sonny00:12:50- It did not look, it was not, it was not the Palm.
Vic00:12:52- No, this might have been the Excalibur. It might have been like Circus Circus, I don't know.
Sonny00:12:57- He's wearing, he's wearing like leopard print pants and, and like loafers, essentially. And like, you know, like a very-
Mike00:13:04- But his shoes are off, he's barefoot though.
Sonny00:13:06- His shoes are off, he's barefoot. And he's, he's just like, he's sprawled out on the couch and you know, the, the poor, you know, maitre d' or whatever is like, "Sir, you gotta leave." And he's like, "Ah, I can't even understand what he's saying." He's like, "No, I gotta, sir." And it's like, okay, this is, this is, this is Nick Cage. He's, he is a Hammer Time. But the best part, the best part of the whole video is, is they, they, they get him up and they're walking him out of the restaurant. And as he is leaving the restaurant, it is midday. It is just blazing sun, just like, you walk outside and you have to shield your eyes from the light coming in. - It's like a matinee.
Vic00:13:48- From the door. - It's like you walked out of a matinee.
Sonny00:13:51- And he's like, I was just like, that's actually, that, that makes the video it changes it from being like kind of sad to actually very funny.
Vic00:14:00- Yeah, you're like, oh my gosh, this is 2:00 AM. You know, go home already.
Sonny00:14:05- Nick Cage, get home. But no, it's middle of the day.
Vic00:14:07I'm like, oh, I recognize that. - It's lunchtime, baby.
Mike00:14:10- He's gotta go to work at lunch.
JVL00:14:12He had a working lunch, he had to get some drinks.
Vic00:14:15- I love the working lunch, as you know. I love walking out and I do the same thing where it's like, it's so bright outside.
JVL00:14:20- Does he then now sit down on the ground on the sidewalk next to Kava and throw up?
Vic00:14:24- That's never, I was on a boat and I was on a bench. I sat on a chair. I put my elbow on the table and I was able to lean down. I was able to lean down sitting. I was sitting on a chair when that happened. - Children going back. - And it was, you know, indigestion.
JVL00:14:40- Mommy, why is that bum throwing up?
Sonny00:14:42- He went down to the garage. Nicholas Cage went down to the garage and threw up next to his car.
Vic00:14:47- Okay, that happened again. I was thinking about, you know, I was just sitting there. I needed to rest. Don't you think I did the safe thing? Sonny, I can't believe you remembered that one as well. And, and I just woke up.
Sonny00:14:59- Do we, should we just run through the greatest hits? It wasn't, it wasn't, it wasn't. - No, no. - No, he wasn't. I'm sorry. I'm mistaken. He actually, he actually had to go into the bathroom where he works. And his boss came in and he was throwing up.
JVL00:15:13- He got an Uber home and then while his kids were watching TV and his wife had company, he threw up on the front steps.
Vic00:15:19- I mean, I walked in and Cage, as I told my wife.
JVL00:15:24- And then Nick Cage's wife said, well, I guess I have to get the hose again.
Vic00:15:27- Yeah. And then the kids watched it. I remember the, the Cage said to me, when she saw me, she said, are you crying?
Mike00:15:33And I just, I should have just said, yes, I'm Sonny JVL. You know, cause my eyes, I'm tearing up. You know how, you can't stop the tears. - I'm sorry.
JVL00:15:41I have to step away. You guys just keep going.
Vic00:15:44- Or the time, or the time my in-laws were watching the kids and then I had to go after the shrimp in the martini pitcher and the whole house heard me, including my son who was sleeping.
Sonny00:15:53- No, no, no. What happened was Nick Cage went out, he went out, uh, to his car . And he just, he went, and then he just went, he went.
Mike00:16:00- You're gonna have to bleep that. That's not true at all. Hey, come on now. It's a family show. It's a family show. I'm sweating over here. I'm sweating. Jamie, I'll miss that too. Oh man, I can't believe you said that. How dare you? I can't believe you went there. That's completely unsubstantiated. There's no proof that that happened. Oh man. That's too much. Okay.
Sonny00:16:27All right. All right. All right. No, no, no, no. I'm sorry. There was a pitcher of martinis.
Vic00:16:32It wasn't a pitcher of martinis. - I'm sweating here. That was all made up.
JVL00:16:35- Can you imagine if they had had cell phone cameras when Vic was in college?
Vic00:16:40- Yeah. - Could you imagine that for any of them? - Actually, the last couple of years. - Nevermind. It would have been fine. - The last year, the last year, it would have been great for them to see me the last year. What did you say? I missed that.
Mike00:16:50I'm sorry.
Sonny00:16:52- Oh God.
Vic00:16:53- Oh man.
JVL00:16:54- So, so your gout is better.
Vic00:16:56- My gout is better, and the only thing is, now I'm dealing with a mild cold. I'm a mild cold, so I'm very tired. I didn't have much sleep, but I'm, you know, it's all like for cool. I'm like in my head, but I am absolutely certain it is just a cold. I can still taste food. I can smell. - I thought you couldn't get colds on the Wolverine blood. - Well, no, cold is okay. Cold is okay. You know, it's the serious stuff that I can't get.
Mike00:17:23Mild cold is. - What good is the Wolverine blood?
Vic00:17:26Then you can still get the common cold. - Well, common cold, you can easily push through. Everybody gets a common cold, but you don't want to--
JVL00:17:33- You need the surgery where they coat your skeleton in adamantium to be able to fight off. You need to finish the evolution, Victorino.
Vic00:17:41- That's right, that's right. But anyway, at least it protects me from the Wu Han. Speaking of which, Shang-Chi over the weekend remained at the top of the box office with 13 million, followed by Dear Evan Hansen, which I don't even know what that is. With seven point, you can tell me about it, 7.4 million. And in third place, again, Free Guy. - Free Guy. - With 4.1 million. I have a feeling that I'm gonna be mentioning Free Guy for like years.
Sonny00:18:08- I saw somebody tweeted something that was like, and in its 872nd weekend at the number two spot, Free Guy with $4 million.
Vic00:18:19- That's right, that's right.
Sonny00:18:20- Has grossed $17 billion so far.
Vic00:18:23- That's true, it's that insane.
Sonny00:18:25- Yeah, yeah, no, that movie's doing well. I'm glad to see it. - Box office spots. - Dear Evan Hansen is a fascinating thing because it's a musical, it's a Broadway musical about a kid who pretends to be best friends with somebody who committed suicide. - Oh. - And the kid in question is supposed to be like a, I guess like a senior in high school or like a junior in high school. And the guy who plays him is 27 but looks like he's about 42 and it just is like, it's like having Vic skulk around the hallways of a high school pretending to be friends with somebody who killed himself so he can get with girls.
Vic00:19:08- Is that what happens in the movie? That's what- - It's not far off.
Sonny00:19:11I'm exaggerating only very slightly here.
JVL00:19:13- So it's an inspirational story.
Sonny00:19:15- Yes. - It's an inspirational. It's like the Chariots of Fire.
Vic00:19:17- When you say it's Broadway, it's not like, it's turned into a movie.
Sonny00:19:21- It's like a musical- - It's not Hamilton or is it? - No, no, no, no, it's not like, they didn't film, they didn't like tape the, they didn't film the action on a Broadway set. It's just, it is an adaptation of a Broadway play. And like all of these, it is just, it's dying. Nobody's going to see it. Like in the Heights before it.
Vic00:19:40- Okay, so thank you. Thank you for explaining what it is. Box office thoughts. Things are gonna change up soon, aren't they?
Sonny00:19:47Maybe. - Shang-Chi has now grossed $13 or $14 million more than Black Widow. I think it's gonna end up around $240 to $250 million. We can just somewhere in there, but the what's interesting, what's interesting is I had missed this, but in the court filing that Disney put out to kind of rebut Scarlett Johansson's case about, you know, she's getting screwed on her box office. They said, and this was as of, this was as of, I think early September, I have to go back and check. They said they have, they have made $120 million off of premier access, which strikes me as an insanely high number. I mean, even with the $60 million opening weekend that they said, and I was like, yeah, that sounds about right. I figured that would be very heavily front-loaded. I figured that would be almost all of it that pretty much everyone would get in that first weekend, but they say they made $120 million off of the premier access, which with the, you know, $180 million gross, that's a $300 million movie domestic, kind of, not really,
JVL00:21:00but it's more than that because they're not splitting the premier access money with theater owners.
Sonny00:21:05Yes, but also more markets than just the United States have access to premier access. So like it, it, it's, it's, it's not quite dollars to dollars to apples to apples, but you know, interesting. I don't know. Okay. I, that, that was interesting to me. I w I was very surprised by how, how high that number was.
Vic00:21:23But this coming up weekend, I, I imagine there's going to be a shake up at the box office with Venom or I assume that's going to be at the top.
Sonny00:21:32Venom will do well. Venom will do well. I'm, I'm curious to see how the many saints of Newark does. I, I, I get the sense that it'll probably be like, I mean, it's already a Sopranos thing.
Vic00:21:42People are used to watching Sopranos at home on TV. And they'll want to watch it at home then.
Sonny00:21:46Yeah. I think that'll, I would be surprised if it grossed more than $10 million. Yeah. Put it that way.
Vic00:21:52Yeah. For the opening weekend. Okay. All right. If we have no other thoughts, moving on to our focus this week is not a movie, but rather a docuseries on Amazon called Lula Rich. Sonny, how about a big boy review?
Sonny00:22:12Lula Rich, Lula Rich. This is an interesting documentary to me because it's, it's really, what it is, is a, an effort by the feminists in the mainstream media and the documentary industrial complex to tear down great American businessmen who by dint of their own hard labor, just put together an amazing billion dollar business that raised women out of poverty, that gave them the ability to earn money on their own. And, and they're just trying to destroy these people. I don't understand it. I don't, I don't, I don't understand what's happening in this documentary. In this documentary, you have these two, you have these two hardworking Mormon, uh, uh, people, a husband and wife. They've got 14 kids, tons of grandkids, great big family, two of the kids are married to each other. Two of the kids are married to each other. Steps. And that's a fantasy story,
JVL00:23:12but they, they talk to your penthouse. I never thought this would happen.
Vic00:23:16They're not related, but they got mad. It's like wild. It's like taboo,
Sonny00:23:20but not they, and they, they, you guys are gross. Let's talk about this. Great American family published my letter. It's great American family. So the, in, in this, in this, in this movie, we see the rise and fall of, uh, what's it called? Lula row, Lula row, um, which is a, it's, it's basically a, a female, uh, clothing company. It's, it, it, it, women wear the leggings. They like the maxi skirts, whatever. That was again, built up out of the trunk of this woman's car. She went town to town. She was selling the things to people. Uh, she found people. Who wanted to sell them themselves. And then the, the, it just built from there like Tupperware parties, like Mary Kay, like whatever. Uh, and, uh, they grew this from a, from a $0 company to a, you know, $7 million company to a billion dollar company just a year later. And I don't understand why I don't, I don't, it doesn't make any sense to me, but the, the media seems very intent on destroying these great hardworking people. I don't know. I don't know what the political, important here is or what, but, uh, you know, it's a story. It's a, it's a classic American success story. You gotta, you've got some losers, some losers in the system who are complaining about it. Um, but I don't know. I don't, I don't see why we have to give them one of them, for instance, as a, as a family member, a relative who betrayed the family and then got busted in a pot scam. I mean, we're supposed to believe these people over the good hardworking people who employ hundreds of thousands of folks all across America. I don't think so. I don't think so. You're missing everything.
JVL00:24:57I'm sorry. What network was this? Is this documentary on? It's on Amazon. Oh, on Amazon. Amazon is the one ticket. Sonny, you're, you got it all wrong. This isn't the feminists.
Sonny00:25:09This is big legging, big, big legging, big tech,
JVL00:25:13big legging is out to crush these hardworking startups. That's what it is because you want to buy it on the other end. You got to come with this. This is from the other end. This is, this is Bezos crushing the competition.
Sonny00:25:28Okay. All right. So I'm, I'm doing a bit. It's a bad one. It's not even working. But the, but the, the, the, the, the, the reason this was interesting to me was because it does feel like it feels like the third film in a triptych of movies that we have done first, the fire fest documentaries and then the, we work documentary and now this, and I feel like there there's, there's a big difference between, I think this I'm totally straight faced being serious here. I think there's a big difference between LuLaRoe and those other companies because LuLaRoe was actually creating a thing. They actually created a product that they sold to people that people liked. And the problem with LuLaRoe is that they got too big, too fast. They just got too big, too fast. And they're, they're, they're good suffered as a result. They had to compromise quality and people got angry about it. And like, I'm not even, I'm not even totally sold on the, the argument that this is a pyramid scheme, multi-level marketing scam. Like there's obviously that element, but the timeline of this documentary is not super clear. At least to me as the viewer, it was not super clear when exactly they shifted away from that because they may, they make a big point in the documentary about talking about how, Oh, our checks went down. Our like our bonus checks went down because our teams, but they did that because they were trying to move away from the multi-level marketing angle and focus on the, the actual clothing. And look, I like, again, they, these folks clearly made mistakes. The two, the two the two people at the head of the company, obviously like mess some stuff up. Obviously they expanded way too quickly. They had way too many of these individual retailers working there. They're there, you know, their sides of the street and like saturating the market. Like there's no one else. This thing was, this thing was unsustainable as it was, as it was kind of created. But like at the same time, I, I have a hard time putting it in the same category of a WeWork or a Theranos or a, uh, or a fire festival. This is just a, this is a, this is a, this is more of a story of like failure to scale than anything else. Am I wrong JBL?
Vic00:27:35Thank you Sonny. JBL, what do you think about this? Wrong.
JVL00:27:40Fair.
Sonny00:27:40I hear we fair.
JVL00:27:42Yeah. So, so it is interesting to me that when you said this was part of a triptych, we didn't even mention the Theranos documentary. And that's because that was not very good. This is, uh, can we just start quad documentary? This is the strongest of all three of those. It's too long. It's, it's too,
Vic00:28:01I disagree. I felt like it was just basically the same form, you know, where you replace, we work with, uh, Lula row. And I mean, it just felt exactly the same for some reason, the music, the graphics, the stretching it out, the graphic design. It felt very much, you know, how they intersperse in between actual interviews. They do all these different things. And anyway, it felt like it. Um,
JVL00:28:27but go ahead JVL, the characters were better. I mean, this, this is stuff full of really interesting, compelling characters. The closest really to the fire festivals closer to that. Right. And the fire festival, we had a bunch of people who we all remember, right? The guy who was like, I had to get down on my knees and suck off the Bahamian that was customs guy.
Vic00:28:46No, he almost did it, but he gave, didn't he give you a cameo shout out?
JVL00:28:53Um, so it's, uh, quad documentary. I thought this thing was awesome and probably 30 minutes too long. Probably could have been a single two and a half hour thing, but doing as a 90 minute show would have been not long enough. Uh, it's visually interesting. They have a trove of really good video, uh, going from stuff that people shot on their own, you know, on the cruises, uh, the things that people shot on Facebook lives when they were doing the sales, the LuLaRoe internal communication videos and zooms, they got recordings of, uh, as I said, the characters are really interesting. And there, I mean, there is that moment in the third episode where, again, I think that unspooling of the story is very masterfully done. And as an example, so they are intercutting deposition video with everything else all through the four episodes. And in the as they're dropping the hammer in episode four, they're deposing one of the family members. And they said, you know, do you remember what, uh, what you, what you meant when you said, uh, what, what do you thought the definition of a pyramid scheme was? And this guy who's like this absurd shirt, it looks like he's got an IQ of 85 goes, I don't recall. And they smash cut to video of him on an internal LuLaRoe communication saying we need to get away from being a pyramid scheme. And it's just like, ah, that's right. It's, it's tremendous. Uh, so, so Sonny, so they, they change in 2017, they begin changing their, their bonus system, which is at the heart of the entire idea of what, what makes it a pyramid scheme versus a being a wholesaler, right? Cause there's, there's a difference between being a wholesaler and a, and a pyramid scheme. And it seems as though the reason they make the change is because they're trying to get one step ahead of the law. So they see the lawsuits coming. They've got a bunch of lawsuits already pending against them. And they simultaneously make these changes and stand up a whole other bunch of shell companies that they start pouring money into in an attempt to make it unrecoverable should, should the lawsuits be successful. So that when you say like, you know, oh, I, I actually don't buy that this is just a problem of scale. It is a, a, it is a pyramid scheme. It was designed to be a pyramid scheme. And when they saw the law coming, they tried to transition out away from it. And one of the things that makes the documentary interesting is that they win sort of, right? So little row is a much shrunken company. They've still got a ton of lawsuits pending. They've got the state of Washington that has decided, yeah, you know, we're gonna keep a close eye on you. We may be prosecuting again. And the company itself is shrinking. And it now looks like Amway.
Sonny00:31:56They settle with Washington state for like $4 million, $4 and a half million dollars, which is nothing. It's a slap on the wrist. Correct. Which again, like, suggest to me that not, not the worst company out there, not the worst, you know?
JVL00:32:11Well, there's whatever. Victorino, I'm curious. I thought as I was watching this, I thought to myself, unless you know anything about the little row world through various Arlington mom stuff, right? You're going to be bored, bored out of your two.
Vic00:32:26That is, that is an amazing handoff JVL. Cause I, I, my opening line was going to be, I'd never heard of Lula Roe until I watched this show. Really? Yeah. Yeah. I didn't. So I didn't know what this was. I thought I'd never heard of it. I thought I had to, are you guys serious? I thought it had to do with Lululemon. And, uh, of course it reminded Arlington, the doc,
JVL00:32:45the doctor's children in Arlington know all about Lululemon, but they've never heard of Lula Roe.
Vic00:32:50I've never heard of Lulu Roe, but Kate was telling me, uh, and she'd never heard of it either, but she did. She's familiar with, yeah, she, but she is familiar with like skincare products that neighbors, like other women, not even that there's another one she told me about. That's like, you know, more hip and trendy. And she pointed, she told me a number of women that we know, uh, that are into that. And then they have parts and they want you to buy things, but it's more than just buying things. I mean, the ideal is that you get them to do the buying, I guess, cuz then it puts you up above and you have enough people, then you're on that the next tier. Um, so, uh, I mean, that was interesting. I mean, it's, it's obviously they wanna play up that it's, this is very cultish that it's, it's a cult, but you know, it's weird because I think a lot of the people who joined up, I mean, it's like they wanted to belong to a cult. You know, they talk about waiting for hours and days and months on that waiting list to get the call, to become a consultant. It's like, don't you have anything, is this really, are you sure you wanna be a part of this thing? Cuz it sounds terrible, but they wanted to do it. Um, so in general, I don't know. I mean, uh, when I watched with Kate, Kate just thought, you know, she thought of the whole thing, they were just these sad sacks, you know, they were just very pathetic and, and, and, but I thought that was all around. I thought everybody, you know, I mean, they're either they're suckers or, or they're, they're, or they're bad people or they were just very annoying. And I found of all people, I found Jill to be the most annoying. I found her more annoying than the husband and wife, uh, couple. Um, although she did remind me of Anna, you know, I mean, it's just this explaining, you know, that goes on about, you know, and she had
Sonny00:34:27this line, the documentary also does this, I'm sorry to interrupt, but the documentary also does this weird thing where it tries to make this a social justice. Yes. Yes. That's exactly what I was going to say. Also, these ladies are very white and like, uh, also they're, they're, they're, this isn't nearly as feminist as they were making it out to be. It's about family. Oh no, about family. And that, that, I, that also, that also, that's jumped out
Vic00:34:51to me. That jumped out at me, except for the only thing I do agree with, what I think is bizarre is that, okay, first of all, they say, you know, the man, you know, the head of the household, the whole thing. Okay. I'm fine with all this so far until the ultimate plan is to get the guy to sell the leggings. And I'm like, wait, no, what? You know, like, okay, get him to quit the job and be the guy. That's insane. Uh, so that for me, I just thought that, okay, that part was nuts. Um, but, uh, I don't know. And the other weird thing is, you know, they talk about these, people were getting, and somebody out there got a bonus check of $70,000. If you were that, wouldn't you quit at that point and say, do something else? Cause like, do you really want
JVL00:35:32to be doing this? It's, it's bizarre, but this is, you know, this is how the pyramid scheme works, right? Is the idea. So I have a very serious question for you boys, which Vic, you will be uninterested in answering and Sonny, you will probably try to not answer. Although maybe you already did, which is how is multi-level marketing slash pyramid scheme any different from normal capitalism? In fact, isn't it maybe just the highest form of capitalism, the ability of the people who own the capital to turn their customers into employees and their employees into customers? I mean, if you put it that way,
Sonny00:36:17I guess, I guess I'm cool with it. Yeah, no, I mean, this is the thing is I don't actually have a problem with the people who are like hiring or they're signing up folks to sell the stuff and what you get, you get a little kickback up, whatever, who cares? Like, I don't I that does not that does not bother me. That does not jump out at me as a thing that is inherently
JVL00:36:35terrible. Well, I mean, this is so but this is a real I mean, I would say this is just a philosophical and ideological difference between myself and you two on whether or not predatory capitalism is a thing. Like does does predatory capitalism exist? And if it exists, is it distinct enough from normal capitalism? So that it should be regulated against the end? I mean, I don't want to turn this into like an econometrics show. But but that's I think the ultimate you guys, I think basically view all capitalism is predatory.
Sonny00:37:08Therefore it's all fine. Yeah, I mean, I like there's winners and losers. And this is this is why I'm being like slightly serious when I like, Oh, I know, I could tell the woman, the woman near the end. With like the she's like, very, like, kind of mousy. Oh, yeah. I didn't like her at all. I was just like, you are you are the most you're the most annoying person in this hole. I would I would rather talk to the I'd rather talk to the Mormon hucksters for like 10 hours than you for five minutes. Because you are just very annoying to me that I felt that
Vic00:37:40exactly. And the way she just said, Okay, thank you. Anyway, thank you, Thomas Piketty. My My question is, Amway, we were talking about today, you know, they bring up Amway. And one of the interesting things is, you know, if Amway were, if it became a thing, now, I mean, would it be getting the same treatment? Because Amway became a thing before anybody had cameras to record all these things and emails and, and the way it grew. I wonder about that. And also, it amazes me that Amway is still a thing. Because I always I always thought Amazon basically fulfilled that need that people had to stay at home, you don't have to go shopping anymore. And yet, I guess it's still out there.
Sonny00:38:23But that's not what the need is, right? The need is not is not the buying, it's the selling the need is to be like I am, I'm creating income, I'm creating a livelihood that we can, you know, rely on to help keep the keep the house afloat. I mean, I like, I get that I get that on a like a very basic sort of human, unlike the Maslow's hierarchy of needs, right? Like I get I get that.
Vic00:38:54I was, I was always mystified by the the allure of Amway because of course, I was pitched Amway by a friend, right? I mentioned this on a previous episode, and who will remain nameless. But, you know, I initially escaped the the meeting the quote, Oh, I've got a you know, a business proposition, I you know, come and come over, inviting all our friends, our friends to our apartment where this guy was going to give a business talk, you know, a pitch. And yes, it was Amway. And although I heard one of my other friends was trying to get him to the guy to admit that it's basically creating a pyramid and didn't want to go there. But he, you know, eventually, he came back just to talk to me. So that was the worst part was I was not part of a large group that can just hide in the corner and drink, but rather it was a one on one. And yet I found it fascinating, just, you know, the way he was trying to do it.
Sonny00:39:56And this is why Vic still has 10 boxes of Amway.
Vic00:39:58That's why I have 10 boxes of turkey tetrazzini. You know, it lasts forever. But you know, and the big pitch was, of course, it was it was like, what do you want life if you can have any car? What would it be if you can live anywhere? Would it be? And, and it was weird because it was like a Glenn, it was like an Alec Baldwin line from Glenn Gary Glen Ross, where the guy actually said, you know, And he was like, this tie, this tie I'm wearing, it's Givenchy with Givenchy, but that's okay. It was like, it's a Givenchy tie, which is even like you can get that at, you know, Marshall's, you know, but he was like showing off that he had this, he can wear this tie, you know,
Sonny00:40:33you can get that at like Saks. Yeah, you can get that. You just, you just roll into a, you roll into a, you know, Lord and Taylor, they've got them all over the place. So, you
Vic00:40:42know, and then it was, and the question is, what would you do if you had more time? Tell me, what would you do? Wouldn't you like that for yourself? That's a double up on me. So that's what, and that was the thing. And then if you want that, here's how you can do it, you know, and it would be even better if you got your friends to do it. But it was about ordering the stuff at home, but the limited, the products were all limited, you know, it's not really a lot of name brands. If you want name brands, now you go to Amazon. That's why I was always amazed. What are they buying?
JVL00:41:12I was forced to do that for, for wrapping paper when I was in sixth grade as a fundraiser for my school.
Sonny00:41:20Do you remember those days? The, the, the one, one way, one way in which the documentary fails, I think, is that it doesn't do a good job of differentiating between the people who were out there really hustling to get more people under them and the people who were selling the clothes and into selling the clothes. Like it feels all of the focus in the documentary is on selling the clothes. And like, we keep seeing the pyramid scheme, uh, graphic over and over again. And we have the guy talking about the multi-level marketing, but there's nobody in the documentary who was like, I was there to get people under me and that's all I was doing.
JVL00:41:54That's, that's what the Hawaiian girl tells us that no, but that's, she's not, she is seller number two. And she literally, literally says, I wrote this down. Um, I know that the experience I had could not be replicated.
Sonny00:42:10She does say that, but she also very explicitly at the end refuses to talk about like, uh, how much she was getting in bonuses versus sales and blah, blah, blah. And she has that giant rack of clothes behind her. Like she has like a whole giant store in her house, but she's off of them. She's she's now, now she just, now she just has to close. Uh, yeah,
JVL00:42:29no, I had great wardrobe. I mean, I, it seemed to me like she was pretty highly lawyer. You talked about the sad people, Victorino. I cannot believe you didn't pick the saddest
Sonny00:42:38character in the entire show. Is that the guy who was answering the emails? The guy
JVL00:42:42who's answering emails, who, uh, who tells us that he came to LuLaRoe because he was a volleyball ref. He had been following his passion to become a referee in girls volleyball. Yes. And had made it up to the junior college ranks after a lot of hard work. And you know, his father said, you know, look, there's no 401k plan for, for reffing girls volleyball. And then he complains about how LuLaRoe ruined Kelly Clarkson for him. One of his favorite artists because she agreed to say, and then this is the honestly the only really mystifying choice in the entire Dutch series. That was where I forgot is allowing this guy to have the last word. And his last word is literally quoting general Martog from star Trek, deep
Sonny00:43:32space nine. And like it's to a quote that isn't even actually his, right. This is like a Quentin Tarantino saying revenge is a dish best served cold and attributing that to star Trek. I like, I don't think the line is actually a star Trek line. No, but the, the, what is what is, what is, what is, what is weird about that? What is weird about that? And what is weird about the, the relative again, who was like busted in some sort of like pot defrauding scheme. Um, and, and the, the, the like weird kind of mousy girl, like all of the heroes in this, in this documentary are deeply unappealing.
JVL00:44:12Yes. Oh, I totally disagree. Totally disagree. I kept a list of the people I thought were clearly the good guys who are fun.
Sonny00:44:19The lawyer, the lady lawyer who is like, ah, my daughter was like, boys can't be lawyers. I was just like, that never happened. That never, that's a, that's a Twitter, that's a Twitter meme bullshit.
JVL00:44:30No, Roberta Blevins, who is the one who is one of the scam people who's clearly very self-aware, uh, Lachey, who is the, the only African-American character in the entire thing who has maybe, maybe the best line of the, so Lachey was hired to work at LuLaRoe corporate and then left to become just a LuLaRoe seller because that's where the real money was. She thought, and she achieves the status to be invited on one of the LuLaRoe cruises. And she says, being on a boat with a whole bunch of white people just isn't my thing. I'm sorry. I love white people to death. It's hysterical. I almost died when, in that moment, uh, they were, and then the, the, the mom who looks like she sells stuff on Etsy from Seattle, whose name is Becca Peter. She is like the character. Remember the fire documentary, the guy who was just obsessed with trying to make people understand that the fire festival was going to be a scam. Oh, and he was like blogging about it. And he was like, look at the island, right? Here's the location you're looking at. There's nothing there. That's who Becca Peter is. Anyway, I thought, I thought the three of them were just absolutely fantastic characters. They were interesting. Uh, I could not agree more about Jill Filipovich and I can't, honestly, I want to be very careful here because it is entirely possible that she was just poorly served by the editing and that the directors used her to be their voice. And maybe she said a whole bunch of very interesting stuff, right? I mean, maybe she, maybe she told them a whole bunch of very interesting things and they edited her in such a way as to make her seem trite and insufferable, but she comes across in the way which she is presented as trite and insufferable.
Sonny00:46:22Yeah. Well, she just, she just comes across as a cardboard progressive journalist cut out. I mean, like that is just, I, when I, when I was watching her, I was just like, she's not saying anything interesting or unexpected here. It's just like, again, like the, the, the, the, the, the asides where it's like, this was, this is a white woman's version of, you know, says the white woman, prosperity and womanhood. And like, I just like if it felt like it felt like, uh, it felt like Twitter talking to me on my, I agree. I would have,
JVL00:46:54I would have rather had that time with Becca or Roberta or I'll tell you who I, you know,
Vic00:46:58you know who I, uh, I enjoyed actually. And I loved listening to him. The entire, every time he was on was the professor. Oh, he was great from the char school. Yeah. Was that where he was from? I think that's where he was. Yeah. He was great. And I found him like very, I'm terrible at these kinds of things, especially, you know, I've never did well in economics. Uh, but, uh, but Listening to him, I could listen to them like, oh, this is making sense to me.
JVL00:47:21All right. I have two things we gotta talk about. Yeah. The first is the revelation that Deanna claims to have gone to Tijuana for her gastric bypass surgery, actually the sleeve in what worlds do people who can afford $2 million sports cars go to Tijuana for surgical procedures?
Vic00:47:49Oh, I, I think you're, uh, is that like going to Switzerland for, you know, like
JVL00:47:54when major blood went to burn Switzerland for that's right. You're right there. Yeah. But, but, but more than that, like going to India for surgery, cuz it's cheaper. This, the, the, the documentary does not connect the dots, but it seems very clear to me that when Deanna comes back and starts trying to push other people to go down to this one doctor gastric sleeve, and that she has agreed to arrange transportation, all that, this is all downline upline that she is getting a kickback from the doc, because why would you go down to Mexico to do surgery? Because in Mexico you can find a doctor who will give you kickbacks on this. And I imagine that in America, a lot of docs would be very afraid to do that because their entire lives could be ruined. Yeah. Yeah. You can lose your license. So I thought that was very interesting that said, it looked like it worked and I'm thinking
Sonny00:48:52about it for long. The Lula Roe watch. All right. Yes. That's what I wanted to, I wanted to talk to you about the big prize. Explain the significance of the break down the watch.
Vic00:49:05Break it down. Break it down because this is the only time Sonny's going to let you
JVL00:49:08talk about horology. So Sonny can, would you like to explain to the people how they make a pretty big deal about the watch? Well, you get the watch if you have,
Sonny00:49:18have a certain number of people under you, right? It was like, if you're the, I forget what the actual tier. Clear level. If you become clear. If you are, if you're a operating Thetan three, you get a gold watch with a triangle on it. Uh, I don't, I, I, but if, if you have like five people under you, you get the watch, right? You get, I think you have to have many more than five, whatever, whatever the number is. Three. If you have three people under you who have five people under them, if you have a total of 76 people and $7 million a year, you get the watch, but like the w the watch looks like the cheapest piece of crap I've ever seen. Um, I, and I'm not, I'm not a watch person as you know, but it just looked, it looked to me, the movements, the movements on the hand and like the actual like fake gold, uh, quality of the band and everything else looked, looked to me like it was a real piece of crap.
JVL00:50:12So the people who talk about the watch, talk about it as if this is the gold Rolex that you're given after 40 years of service to the company. Am I misrepresenting that?
Mike00:50:23Right. I mean, it, it is like, oh, we got the watch. I can't believe I made it. I have
JVL00:50:30a real watch. This is it. Yeah. So I looked at this thing and I thought, no, I can tell you right away. This is, this is a quartz piece of crap. And in fact it is. So those watches are made by Vestal, which is I. I own a, uh, Vestal digital tide watch. One of the worst watches I've ever owned in my life. Uh, it is a fashion watch brand, which is to say a crap watch brand. Uh, the total, this is a $60 watch. Maybe the cost to purchase it goes up to 120 bucks because making custom dials can be expensive. Something I have a little bit of experience with, uh, all right. Cause it says, but it's not, it's not gold. It is steel with rose gold plating. Uh, and in fact, you can find one on eBay for 40 bucks right now, if you like $40, uh, these, the idea again, everything about this is predatory. And you, when you go to people who do not know better, and you say things like here, buy this, buy this box of things for $5,000 and you don't get to choose what's in the box. Uh, you just get, we're just going to send you a box and it's $5,000. You can't ever return it. And, uh, by the way, if you would, it changed briefly, right. It changed for a month for like a hot five minutes. And when the minute it changed, everybody started jumping ship. And so they stop it. And, and by the way, your compensation is not actually tied to selling these things. Your compensation is tied to going out and convincing other people to sell them and then having other be. I mean, what the reason governments legislate against these things is not because, uh, they are mean, but because they are not sustainable, they aren't real businesses. I mean, like the definition of a scam, right. And the difference between a scam and a business is that a scam is not sustainable because there's no actual value created. Yeah. And that these things
Sonny00:52:47are not there. There is no value creation. Well, but you were, again, I, I have to disagree slightly in the sense that. All right. So first off you, you are, you are misunderstanding what the actual value of the watch is. The watch is not valuable because it is $120 or $60 watch. And they thought it was a thousand dollar watch, right? The, the watch is valuable because it, it's shows the progress that you have made. It's a thing you can show to the other Lula row people and be like, look at me. I'm I've got many people under me. Whatever signifies that. So that, that's, that's yeah, whatever. But like, again, this, this was a company that was creating actual goods that were being sold to people that, you know, people wanted to buy, people wanted to buy these dumb, ugly leggings and maxi skirts and whatever. And like, that's a thing that people wanted that, that, that the fact that it all got tangled up in this, you know, pyramid scheme aspect is, I think, again, it's unfortunate. It's unfortunate, but it is, it is fundamentally a different thing from the other, the other scams that we have watched documentaries.
JVL00:53:57Victorino, watch this. I'm going to turn Sonny around in three sentences. Sonny, the LuLaRoe liking empire was built on the back of intellectual property theft with their designers stealing images from real artists on Google and then repurposing them without paying rights. Now, what do you think? Where's your God now?
Sonny00:54:20That's a real problem. I, well, but this, this all gets back to the fact that the clothes were just ugly to begin with. I mean, it was just a, it was like literally just cut and paste images on a, on a screen that they, the ones that gave the illusion of genitalia.
Vic00:54:34That's great. I can wear that one. That's what I was hoping for. I'm going to get that for me. Okay.
Sonny00:54:39I can't believe you're just giving weed guy such a pass here. We guy JV. Well, the nephew, this, this nephew who was clearly like either as big or a bigger scam artist than anybody else in this, this entire process who is just getting a pass because he's on the right side of history. He's on the right side here, but no, he's, he's like, he's an actual bad person. I think he's actually might be the worst person in this whole, right? The worst people in the show. When he's, when he's, when he's like sending, when he's sending that woman, the text messages, like, look at all this cash I've got. Invest in my weed company and we'll be, we'll double your, we'll triple your money. How is that guy not worse than what is actually, he's a million times worse.
JVL00:55:25No, he's top five. He's not worse than Mark and Deanne and he's not worse than retailer. Number two, but he's bad. Number one. Thank you. Well, Deanne is number one. I was counting it was whatever. Yeah. I, I can't believe you guys didn't like it. Quad documentary.
Sonny00:55:46He's number one. Oh, he's number one. Yeah, fine weed guys. No, uh, I mean it's, it's fine. It's too long. I mean, it's, it's, it's, uh, it's almost three hours. It's a little more
JVL00:55:55than three hours. The last thing we watched that wasn't too long. This is the world we
Vic00:56:00live in now. Cry macho was an hour 40 and I love that movie. That was probably, I still love that movie. Okay. Uh, all right then. Moving right along. Uh, do you have any, uh, corrections or shout outs? Anything? Everything. Everybody's good. No. Okay. Uh, let's see. Uh, well in that case, uh, that is all the time we're giving to this episode. Questions, comments, compliments. Tweet us at Sonny Bunch at Victorino Matus. Again, be sure to subscribe to us on Patreon. Just go to subbeacon.com. We're there. Tell your friends. Until next time.
JVL00:56:39That's a really great episode of firing line. We just did. Wanted to go there.
Sonny00:56:46I thought it was good.
Vic00:56:47It's good. It's interesting. I learned something.
Sonny00:56:48I have somebody, somebody, I got, I got, I have, I have a question. Who, which one of you animals out there sent me this? I'm showing, uh, uh, Vick and, uh, it's a, it's a stamp. It's like a, it's like a, it's like an embosser. Oh, that says, that says Sonny, Sonny Bunch, always right. Dallas, Texas. That's a shout out right there to somebody. I'm going to put all that. I'm going to put that on all of my books, but I need to figure out who. Who it was that sent it to me. Which one of you, which one is probably, I bet it was Shannon. Cause she's the only one who has my address. You should become a notary. I bet it was Mrs. Last.
JVL00:57:24You should become a notary and use that instead of your official notary seal and see if anybody ever notices. That's very nice.
Sonny00:57:30Sonny, always right.
Vic00:57:31That's very nice. Um, uh, so are we not going to watch Venom at all? We have to watch Venom. I mean, we can if you want to, I guess. No, I mean, are we going to discuss it or no? I a hundred percent want to watch Venom. I feel like there's going to be a lagging week somewhere coming up and then we're going to have to probably just do it then. But, okay.
Sonny00:57:46I feel like you'd probably, I'm trying to decide which you would like more, Venom or The Last Duel.
Vic00:57:52Oh, me?
Sonny00:57:53Yeah.
Vic00:57:54What is The Last Duel? That's not...
Sonny00:57:55The Last Duel is the one with Adam Driver and Matt Damon and Ben Affleck.
Vic00:58:00That's right. Not to be confused with the... And Jodie Comer.
Sonny00:58:02Oh, well. She is, she is assaulted.
Vic00:58:04We might just have that on.
Sonny00:58:05Or maybe not.
Vic00:58:06We, okay. We're going to have to check this all out. Uh, yeah, I don't know.
Sonny00:58:11It's, it's, it's about the last duel in France. Uh, she, she... She said her honor was violated and Matt Damon and Adam Driver fight it out with swords. Lightsabers? Cheering crowds. Or swords. This is exciting. You might like that, I think.
Vic00:58:25Good. Add that to the list. And, and...
Mike00:58:28Are their tits out?
Vic00:58:30I don't know. Great question. That's terrible. Uh, the, uh, in Venom, uh, it's like the same cast, right? Is Spider-Man going to make an appearance? No. Really? No. I mean, like, they're not going to acknowledge that, what it looks like. I mean... Peter Parker? They're not even going to mention his name? Nothing. Completely separate universe. All right, fine. Do you know, do you know what else I'm looking forward to, uh, if we see the movie? Uh, the CGI Michelle Williams again. Because she was so good CGI'd last time.
JVL00:59:00Um, that's not fine.
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